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Millwall (A) League 1 Saturday 15/9/07.

Reports and reaction from the 2007-08 season as Walsall finished 12th in League 1
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Plastic Hawk
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Fri Sep 14, 2007 2:15 pm

stig wrote:
BathSaddler wrote:Mooney out again. No worries, with the new Eusebio we'll be fine :roll:

I despair, I really do. I never say this, but I'm glad I'm working and have no intention of finding out how we are getting on during tomorrow afternoon. You have to protect yourself somehow.

I'm more excited about the Gas playing Leeds tonight. For the first time in a while, I'm casting an envious glance at Bristol Rovers. They have three decent strikers, all of whom are scoring on a regular basis. They spent 150K on two League Two players [Andy Williams and David Pipe, both in their, gasp, 20's] who seem to have bridged the 'huge gap' [Copyright UTS] between the divisions pretty easily.

One of their three strikers, Lambert, was signed last season for 200K as a replacement for Agogo with a proven record of quality and it has paid off, big time [admittedly after a poor start]. We, on the other hand, give short term contracts based on 'off-field connections' to players who are either untried/untested with the hope, though with little obvious evidence, that we come up with a gem.

It's crud, is'nt?


Just about sums up how I feel about it. Seems a long way from sunny Nottingham in April.


It's a long way to sunny Bournemouth next April too. While there's plenty of cause for concern at the moment, there's also plenty of time to sort it out. It's still far too early to throw the towel in.

BathSaddler
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Fri Sep 14, 2007 2:23 pm

Registered Saddler wrote:Sell Agogo for £200k, spend £200k on Lambert. Sell Scott Sinclair for approx £150k, spend approx £150k on Pipe and Williams. We've sold - who exactly? - to be able to spend those sort of fees? Besides which, Bristol Rovers have just spent five or six years struggling in the bottom division, something that we haven't done since the time we nearly went out of business at the start of the 1990s. Still, our comparison with Rovers is a good one. They were struggling near the bottom of League Two in September but stuck by their talented manager and ended up getting promotion. Oh - that wasn't what you meant, was it?


You may have a point RS, but we very rarely replace players in that way. The most recent I can think of is the 150K outlay for Leitao a few months after Ricketts left for 400K, and the buying of Andy Watson for 60K after the selling of Lightbourne to Coventry for 500K. As for Fryatt/Bennett, well whether Merson spent it all or not [and I doubt that was the case, we don't even know what the fees were] it is highly unlikely that any of it would have been for a fee even if Plan A would have worked - Peacock eventually went to Swindon on a free.

Rovers were indeed struggling early on last season - they were lying 17th as late as early March - and Lambert was pivotal to their rise and rise, when he eventually found form. They not only stuck by their talented manager, but provided the funds to enable them to get promotion, by replacing Agogo with Lambert in the first place. If you are making some kind of correlation with DD this season - he may well get us out of trouble, but if you think we will go out and sign a Lambert-type player then you are sadly mistaken.

BathSaddler
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Fri Sep 14, 2007 2:28 pm

Plastic Hawk wrote:
Registered Saddler wrote:Sell Agogo for £200k, spend £200k on Lambert. Sell Scott Sinclair for approx £150k, spend approx £150k on Pipe and Williams. We've sold - who exactly? - to be able to spend those sort of fees? Besides which, Bristol Rovers have just spent five or six years struggling in the bottom division, something that we haven't done since the time we nearly went out of business at the start of the 1990s. Still, our comparison with Rovers is a good one. They were struggling near the bottom of League Two in September but stuck by their talented manager and ended up getting promotion. Oh - that wasn't what you meant, was it?


We could sell Scott Dann to fund investment in midfield and up front - we've got plenty of defenders after all.

See what people say about Bonser if that does happen. I can guarantee that it won't be complimentary... :wink:


The fact is if we sold Dann he would not be replaced with anything approaching comparable quality. It very rarely has.

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Plastic Hawk
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Fri Sep 14, 2007 2:43 pm

BathSaddler wrote:
Plastic Hawk wrote:
Registered Saddler wrote:Sell Agogo for £200k, spend £200k on Lambert. Sell Scott Sinclair for approx £150k, spend approx £150k on Pipe and Williams. We've sold - who exactly? - to be able to spend those sort of fees? Besides which, Bristol Rovers have just spent five or six years struggling in the bottom division, something that we haven't done since the time we nearly went out of business at the start of the 1990s. Still, our comparison with Rovers is a good one. They were struggling near the bottom of League Two in September but stuck by their talented manager and ended up getting promotion. Oh - that wasn't what you meant, was it?


We could sell Scott Dann to fund investment in midfield and up front - we've got plenty of defenders after all.

See what people say about Bonser if that does happen. I can guarantee that it won't be complimentary... :wink:


The fact is if we sold Dann he would not be replaced with anything approaching comparable quality. It very rarely has.


I agree. I'm not actually suggesting that we do sell Dann, just saying that every time we do sell a player the club get slated for it - even before we know how much of the money will be available for a replacement.

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kshammer
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Fri Sep 14, 2007 2:49 pm

Ok, so we aint sold anyone of note this year but in the past few years we recieved money for Fryatt, Bennett, Constable, Staunton and Ricketts. We never invested the proceeds in new, promising talent, but prefer to rely on either over the hill old players or loanees who are just here to pick up some wages and put themselves in the shop window. Think of the players we have missed in the last few years who with a bit of speculation, we may have got. Kevin Harper (1st time round), Julian Joachim, Andy Ritchie... not one came. Don't give me the "can't afford them" arguement because we've had countless players in through the door, whose salaries would've added up to the same money. Why sign two or three bags of s!#t, when one good one would be better? If they get injured then you give a youngun a chance.

Our investment this year is disgraceful. Sonner, Hall, Weston, Boetien, Mooney and these foreign lads. Boertien looks to be the one real gem, and Mooney will give you his all. The rest? Who knows....

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Plastic Hawk
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Fri Sep 14, 2007 3:00 pm

kshammer wrote:Ok, so we aint sold anyone of note this year but in the past few years we recieved money for Fryatt, Bennett, Constable, Staunton and Ricketts. We never invested the proceeds in new, promising talent, but prefer to rely on either over the hill old players or loanees who are just here to pick up some wages and put themselves in the shop window. Think of the players we have missed in the last few years who with a bit of speculation, we may have got. Kevin Harper (1st time round), Julian Joachim, Andy Ritchie... not one came. Don't give me the "can't afford them" arguement because we've had countless players in through the door, whose salaries would've added up to the same money. Why sign two or three bags of s!#t, when one good one would be better? If they get injured then you give a youngun a chance.

Our investment this year is disgraceful. Sonner, Hall, Weston, Boetien, Mooney and these foreign lads. Boertien looks to be the one real gem, and Mooney will give you his all. The rest? Who knows....


Harper went to Portsmouth for £300k. Now I know you said not to use this, but - really - we can't afford that. (I know Bonser claimed to have matched the bid, but we all know that the bid was made on the assumption that Harper wouldn't choose us over Portsmouth.)

Joachim chose to go to his home town club over us. I don't know the full details (and with Boston there could have been all kinds of murky deals going on) but the word was that once they came in he was never going anywhere else.

Paul Ritchie was one of our players (not a loanee). He left the club, not unreasonably, when we got relegated. I don't really see your point with him.

Incidentally, how much money do you think we got for Staunton and Constable?

Bernie
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Fri Sep 14, 2007 3:25 pm

Let us hope that Butler can follow Mooney by scoring on his birthday.

Butler is 33 on Saturday, so he will have the chance to prove wrong those of us who suspect that the years may be catching up on him.

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Fri Sep 14, 2007 3:34 pm

BathSaddler wrote:You may have a point RS, but we very rarely replace players in that way. The most recent I can think of is the 150K outlay for Leitao a few months after Ricketts left for 400K, and the buying of Andy Watson for 60K after the selling of Lightbourne to Coventry for 500K. As for Fryatt/Bennett, well whether Merson spent it all or not [and I doubt that was the case, we don't even know what the fees were] it is highly unlikely that any of it would have been for a fee even if Plan A would have worked - Peacock eventually went to Swindon on a free.

Rovers were indeed struggling early on last season - they were lying 17th as late as early March - and Lambert was pivotal to their rise and rise, when he eventually found form. They not only stuck by their talented manager, but provided the funds to enable them to get promotion, by replacing Agogo with Lambert in the first place. If you are making some kind of correlation with DD this season - he may well get us out of trouble, but if you think we will go out and sign a Lambert-type player then you are sadly mistaken.


I hope it won't come to that, because it will have involved selling one of our good players. I think the facts of our financial situation are not in dispute, unless anyone wants to make the unwise move of accusing the club of falsifying their accounts. The plan has always been to spend only what we can afford while not running up a debt. That is, apart from one season, when we had loads of quality in the team - Merson, Samways, O'Neill, Ritchie - and ironically that is the year that everyone says Bonser didn't back the manager enough!

Free transfers aren't free. Loan transfers aren't free. All these things cost money and as far as I can ascertain it is up to the manager how he spends his playing budget. It was obviously a mistake letting Merson manage his budget, but I trust DD to do a better job than that. Are the players we have brought in so far good enough? I don't think we can judge just yet. Do we have enough depth? Not in central midfield, but in other areas, yes. That is where Rovers may fall down, by the way. Is the budget big enough? I think it is as big as we can afford, and should be ok to see us comfortably safe. Starting with a win tomorrow, if for no other reason than it will prove Sheff wrong!

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Duke
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Sat Sep 15, 2007 7:27 am

Michael Dobson has fully recovererd from his injury, but is unlikely to play at Millwall due to the death of his father , sad news.

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Four Oaks Saddler
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Sat Sep 15, 2007 11:59 am

Can only really see a draw at best - and a pretty ugly one at that. However, that might be the kind of result / performance needed to instill a bit of confidence and kick-start our season.

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Jolly Johnny
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Sat Sep 15, 2007 12:47 pm

Magic Man Fan wrote:We'll win this, I'm sure of it as I can't go. We often win the league matches I can't attend and hope the trend won't change now.

The same clean sheet as against Vale but unlike the previous two games we will take one of the many chances.

1-0. Butler.


Any chance you can stay away till, say..next April MMF?!!! :lol:

Still gonna find it hard to win our first game I feel, 1-1 with Hall for us.

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Jolly Johnny
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Sat Sep 15, 2007 12:50 pm

DAVEDEAN wrote:Michael Dobson has fully recovererd from his injury, but is unlikely to play at Millwall due to the death of his father , sad news.


Indeed, very sad news. Thoughts with him and family. Hope we see him back very soon and back to his best.

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Sat Sep 15, 2007 1:25 pm

Ince
Weston, Dann, Roper, Boertien
Wrack, Sonner, Gerrard, Fox
Hall, Butler

Rubadubs: Junior, Bossu, ASBO, Mr Sunshine, Deeney

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Duke
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Sat Sep 15, 2007 1:29 pm

Hall upfront again :evil:

Bernie
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Sat Sep 15, 2007 1:31 pm

Gerrard in midfield, Hall up front.

Did DD watch the match last week?

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Four Oaks Saddler
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Sat Sep 15, 2007 1:32 pm

I don't understand the selection of Hall upfront again after his performance last week - especially seeing as i'd (personally) prefer all the four outfield players on the bench up front instead of him.

However, please feel free to prove me wrong Paul.

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Duke
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Sat Sep 15, 2007 1:41 pm

Hall as been a big disappointment for me.

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Goose277
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Sat Sep 15, 2007 1:43 pm

DAVEDEAN wrote:Hall upfront again :evil:


:shock: :shock: :shock:

After what I saw against Vale, this is a shocking decision. I hope he proves me wrong but truly shocking.

:shock: :shock: :shock:

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Four Oaks Saddler
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Sat Sep 15, 2007 1:46 pm

DAVEDEAN wrote:Millwall hope to have veteran defender Richard Shaw (hamstring) available for the match against Walsall.
On-loan Tottenham midfielder Jamie O'Hara, who was suspended for the Brighton game, is available.

Walsall will be without strikers Tommy Mooney (calf) and Carlos Carneiro (shoulder) for the away trip.

Defender Alan Picken is hoping to return but will be restricted to the bench as he continues to regain match fitness after his knee problems.

:shock:


Good to see Picken on the bench too. :roll:

Keep up the good work BBC - you keep writing it, and it's bound to happen some time (we hope).

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Jolly Johnny
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Sat Sep 15, 2007 1:50 pm

Registered Saddler wrote:Ince
Weston, Dann, Roper, Boertien
Wrack, Sonner, Gerrard, Fox
Hall, Butler

Rubadubs: Junior, Bossu, ASBO, Mr Sunshine, Deeney


Loving that 16!!! Could you have a more attackminded bench? :lol:
Maybe we'll play defence first half and attack second half like a training game!

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jeffsmate
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Sat Sep 15, 2007 1:57 pm

Anyone got commentary on saddlers world yet, i can't get it, again. :twisted:

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Duke
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Sat Sep 15, 2007 2:04 pm

no great suprise to see WM covering the Dingles :roll: AGAIN!!

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Sat Sep 15, 2007 2:40 pm

Not too happy with the starting xi......Lets hope we bloody win today!!!!

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Sat Sep 15, 2007 2:42 pm

Ropers injured i think

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Sat Sep 15, 2007 2:43 pm

Sonko on for Ropes

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Stu
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Sat Sep 15, 2007 2:43 pm

Foxyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy

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PT
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Sat Sep 15, 2007 2:43 pm

get in foxy

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loop
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Sat Sep 15, 2007 2:44 pm

foxyyyyyyyyyyyy!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :lol:

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Sat Sep 15, 2007 2:44 pm

Danny Fox YEEEEEEEEEEEESSSSSSSSSSSS

1-0

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Sat Sep 15, 2007 2:44 pm

Roper knoked out according to Pedro...Fox scored?

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