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Questions to send to Roy and co

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BathSaddler
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Re: Questions to send to Roy and co

Tue Sep 08, 2009 4:38 pm

Geordiesaddler wrote:That's exactly what its like BS!

You also tend to see greater continuity of service from more local players, and that makes things more interesting. Just like Walsall V Chesterfield was always about Buckley versus Ernie Moss tyoe of thing. I also think its the only "place" in football where the FA Cup retains its magic, and people look upon it as the holy grail, just as we used to in the lower leagues.

In you want to have any old fashioned banter with professional players these days, expect either a tirade of snarling abuse or a quizical look from some foreign bloke.

The other great thing is the absence of namby pamby health and safety. Yes folks plastic bottle tops are not regarded as lethal weapons, you can smoke or move away from someone who is smoking if you want, stand behind the goal for the last 20 minutes when the pressure of an important goal is building, go for a pint, mingle with opposition supporters, let the kids run loose without any fear of harm or being reported to social services, take you own food without contravening subsection 4.8 of the European directive on movement of foodstuffs between the outside world and football stadia, tell the players off for swearing and recieve an apology, get thanked by the manager for going to away games etc etc.

Its great, I love it. Replica kit currently drying in a force 8 gale in rediness for tonight's encounter with two times world cup winners West Auckland Town.

If its nil nil I'll get a protrait of Jeff Bonser and hang it in my shop window with the word's "Our Saviour" underneath.

There hasn't been a goaless draw in a league fixture at Hillheads Park since April 2003.


As a follower of local league football at a similar level here in the West [with a bit of Blue Square Conference South thrown in], I recognise completely what you're saying Geordie. I go with a couple of people who have been regulars at Ashton Gate and Villa Park for years, and who now, more often than not, get their football fix at Plain Ham, Larkhall [Western League Premier Division], right underneath the Solsbury Hill that Peter Gabriel sang about. A great setting, where a pint at half time costs a little over £2 and a proper mug of tea 50p. It's a friendly, no-nonsense sort of place which is largely about both community and football, the standard of which is much better sometimes than you have a right to expect. What's more, they are ambitious and attendances have nearly doubled to around 100 in the last couple of years, and It's the nearest I have had to a proper buzz in at least a couple of years. We're even sponsoring a match ball in a few home matches time.

The reason I like it so much is the sense that everyone is pulling in the same direction, from the chair/vice chair right through to the volunteers and those who pay to get in every other week. You also know that any money raised is going for the benfit of the club, and that you, by buying that cup of tea/beer, are contributing in some way. That feeling has been lost at Walsall, and is probably the primary reason why people do not attend - it's certainly mine.

I still go to a few away games to see Walsall, but I never attend Bescot/Banks's these days. I went to Charlton recently, had a good day, but that was inspite of the football, and the lack of passion displayed both on and off the pitch was there for all to see. The travel costs plus the £25 to get in to watch it was, in itself, simply not worth it, and the quality on show did not seem 5 times more than my local non league club.

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Geordiesaddler
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Re: Questions to send to Roy and co

Tue Sep 08, 2009 4:54 pm

I agree about the quality. Obviously pro players are fitter and faster, but not by that much these days . The way the professional game has gone I don't think that necessarily makes for a better footballing spectacle either, likewise the pathetic standard of refereeing you often see in League games coupled with the black and white rules re sendings off etc.

Of course the rules are the same lower down, but common sense seems to prevail. Tackling is still part of the game for example, and conditions are taken into account. I hate it when Whitley Bay get a big game and we get some big time charlie ref from the FA. I've seen 6 Vase semi finals over the years and all but one had a sending off that spoilt the occasion.

I too have indulged in a bit of sponsorship this year, because i feel I'm ripping the club off paying just £90 for a family season ticket, for a club that scored 152 goals last season, took me to Wembley, and contrived to hang on to its entire playing squad in the face of interest from other clubs, and then added a quality creative midfielder who has already netted 3 goals.

Attendance wise, the last 0-0 draw at Hillheads was watched by 80 people, this year the average is around 450. It seems many people up and down the country are getting the message, the ones who arn't are people like Roy Whalley whose well paid job it is to preserve commercial income, and its Walsall FC who are suffering as a result.

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Geordiesaddler
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Re: Questions to send to Roy and co

Tue Sep 08, 2009 10:41 pm

Geordiesaddler wrote:That's exactly what its like BS!

You also tend to see greater continuity of service from more local players, and that makes things more interesting. Just like Walsall V Chesterfield was always about Buckley versus Ernie Moss tyoe of thing. I also think its the only "place" in football where the FA Cup retains its magic, and people look upon it as the holy grail, just as we used to in the lower leagues.

In you want to have any old fashioned banter with professional players these days, expect either a tirade of snarling abuse or a quizical look from some foreign bloke.

The other great thing is the absence of namby pamby health and safety. Yes folks plastic bottle tops are not regarded as lethal weapons, you can smoke or move away from someone who is smoking if you want, stand behind the goal for the last 20 minutes when the pressure of an important goal is building, go for a pint, mingle with opposition supporters, let the kids run loose without any fear of harm or being reported to social services, take you own food without contravening subsection 4.8 of the European directive on movement of foodstuffs between the outside world and football stadia, tell the players off for swearing and recieve an apology, get thanked by the manager for going to away games etc etc.

Its great, I love it. Replica kit currently drying in a force 8 gale in rediness for tonight's encounter with two times world cup winners West Auckland Town.

If its nil nil I'll get a protrait of Jeff Bonser and hang it in my shop window with the word's "Our Saviour" underneath.

There hasn't been a goaless draw in a league fixture at Hillheads Park since April 2003.


Awwww what a shame, my Bonser is our saviour poster will have to go in the bin. Just a routine 3-1 win picked out of the 25-30 or so goal attempts by two teams going hell for leather at each other for 90 minutes, watched by 359 very noisey supporters, which is unreal for midweek football at step 5 of the pyramid, with zero away fans.

Maybe Roy "teacher of the plebs" Whalley could take a break from transforming Walsall FC from a club that owns its own ground, owes a few hundred grand, and has about 5,000 fans, into one that owns feck all, owes a few million quid , and has 3,000 fans to come and see how things are done in the proper world.

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Whitters
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Re: Questions to send to Roy and co

Tue Sep 08, 2009 11:22 pm

Good job you weren't born in the 40s or 50s Geordie as you'd still be weeping and going on about the demise of steam engines and large manufacturing industry.
I was born in Pleck but lived in Darlaston and followed them (well, went to home games anyway as they were only a few hundred yards from home).
So when we moved to Walsall and I started to follow them I never felt 100% they were my team.
It was such a big club with so many supporters all of whom were strangers
But I never went back to Darlaston.
The "big time" appealed to me in my impressionable teenage years - clubs I heard of on the telly or in the papers visiting, cup runs, the joys of following your team away from home....
The hook was in and it's not going to come out.

Yearn for your lost youth and simpler times and your traditional ales etc all you like but don't expect all of us to be the same.
I've read your stuff and I respect it but don't expect me to be the same no matter what names I get called.

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Geordiesaddler
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Re: Questions to send to Roy and co

Tue Sep 08, 2009 11:54 pm

How do you know I wasn't born in the 40's or 50's?

I might not mourn the passing of steam engines, but I do mourn the passing of a railway network we could be proud of, one that actually worked, and one that gave railways to the world.

Likewise I'm proud of the fact that we invented football in this country. Without the enthusiasm and effort of the founders of football, and football clubs what would you "Whitters" have to whitter on about in this newfangled goggledegook modern age?

You are completely entitled to your opinion, but give us some substance rather than just whinging about your opine entitlement!!


Disagree with me all you want, but t least there's something of substance for you to disagree with. What exactly is your point??

Reading your posts is honestly like eating a bowl of fresh air. Take that as an insult if you so wish, I just find it so dissapointing.

So we have to move on do we?? Because the past was rubbish and the future always brings improvements. Who says? And how so??

By the way I'm watching football in the present, its value for money, entertaining and lots of other people are starting to do it.

Lots of people watching Walsall are stopping doing it - now in 2009 - because its boring, poor value for money, and not entertaining.

So who's behind the times and who's up with them?? Its not lost youth that's being yearned for, its lost football clubs, whos various lots have been thrown in withn TV companies and trite so called businessmen. They have warped and perverted football for their own ends and called it progress. It isn't progress in any way shape or form, its crass, unsustainable exploitation. The whole Premiership (God almighty even the self-proclaimed word itself tells you all you need to know), is teetering on the verge of bankrupcy. Show me a Premiership club that isn't massively in debt, or wouldn't be if it wasn't for a rich sugar-daddy, and that's with the billions in prize money, tv dosh and sponsorship rights. None of these businesses are therefore well run, yet the stupid people in the lower leagues (including Conference) Contunue to by and large ape the failed and flawed Premiership model so that they might get their turn on the cash mamory before it finally runs dry. Its unprincipled train wreck stuff, Just ask Oxford United, Bradford City, leeds United, Chester, Luton, Salisbury, Farsley Caltic, Norwich, Southampton, etc etc etc etc. English football is in a monumental mess compared to say 40 years ago when we had a thriving professional game, amature game, and a national side that was world Champions. And by the way 40 years ago, a little club called Walsall, playing in the third division, regularly got gates double and three times what what they get now. There wasn't a "Bonser suite" or a Sunday market, just a football club, and some of the local players that got their chance and honed their craft at humble Fellows Park went on to play for England, never mind Coventry. Now that's somethig to be really proud of.

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swiftyboy
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Re: Questions to send to Roy and co

Wed Sep 09, 2009 8:50 am

Whitters wrote:Good job you weren't born in the 40s or 50s Geordie as you'd still be weeping and going on about the demise of steam engines and large manufacturing industry.
I was born in Pleck but lived in Darlaston and followed them (well, went to home games anyway as they were only a few hundred yards from home).
So when we moved to Walsall and I started to follow them I never felt 100% they were my team.
It was such a big club with so many supporters all of whom were strangers
But I never went back to Darlaston.
The "big time" appealed to me in my impressionable teenage years - clubs I heard of on the telly or in the papers visiting, cup runs, the joys of following your team away from home....
The hook was in and it's not going to come out.

Yearn for your lost youth and simpler times and your traditional ales etc all you like but don't expect all of us to be the same.
I've read your stuff and I respect it but don't expect me to be the same no matter what names I get called.


Whitters, as mentioned above, you are entitled to your own opinion but i just dont "get" your way, and other peoples way of thinking i really dont.

No-one is asking you not to support the club, or stop attending games. Its just a shame that you are either too blinkered, or too scared to admit the very real and worrying things that are going wrong behind the scenes of the club we all love!

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swiftyboy
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Re: Questions to send to Roy and co

Wed Sep 09, 2009 8:52 am

Geordiesaddler wrote:That's exactly what its like BS!

You also tend to see greater continuity of service from more local players, and that makes things more interesting. Just like Walsall V Chesterfield was always about Buckley versus Ernie Moss tyoe of thing. I also think its the only "place" in football where the FA Cup retains its magic, and people look upon it as the holy grail, just as we used to in the lower leagues.

In you want to have any old fashioned banter with professional players these days, expect either a tirade of snarling abuse or a quizical look from some foreign bloke.

The other great thing is the absence of namby pamby health and safety. Yes folks plastic bottle tops are not regarded as lethal weapons, you can smoke or move away from someone who is smoking if you want, stand behind the goal for the last 20 minutes when the pressure of an important goal is building, go for a pint, mingle with opposition supporters, let the kids run loose without any fear of harm or being reported to social services, take you own food without contravening subsection 4.8 of the European directive on movement of foodstuffs between the outside world and football stadia, tell the players off for swearing and recieve an apology, get thanked by the manager for going to away games etc etc.

Its great, I love it. Replica kit currently drying in a force 8 gale in rediness for tonight's encounter with two times world cup winners West Auckland Town.

If its nil nil I'll get a protrait of Jeff Bonser and hang it in my shop window with the word's "Our Saviour" underneath.

There hasn't been a goaless draw in a league fixture at Hillheads Park since April 2003.


Talking of ridiculous rules and regulations that are ruining our way of life, see the thread "best e-mail ever"

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SheffieldSaddler
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Re: Questions to send to Roy and co

Wed Sep 09, 2009 10:02 am

Where is the response from Roy then?

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Whitters
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Re: Questions to send to Roy and co

Wed Sep 09, 2009 9:04 pm

Geordie said "Lots of people watching Walsall are stopping doing it - now in 2009 - because its boring, poor value for money, and not entertaining."

And also because depressives like you and your ilk are infecting other fans with your continual whining.

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Re: Questions to send to Roy and co

Wed Sep 09, 2009 9:47 pm

Whitters wrote:Geordie said "Lots of people watching Walsall are stopping doing it - now in 2009 - because its boring, poor value for money, and not entertaining."

And also because depressives like you and your ilk are infecting other fans with your continual whining.



:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: Open your eyes FFS

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SheffieldSaddler
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Re: Questions to send to Roy and co

Wed Sep 09, 2009 10:43 pm

swiftyboy wrote:
Whitters wrote:Geordie said "Lots of people watching Walsall are stopping doing it - now in 2009 - because its boring, poor value for money, and not entertaining."

And also because depressives like you and your ilk are infecting other fans with your continual whining.



:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: Open your eyes FFS


Swifty, I wouldnt bother mate. He aint going to open them ever!
:wink:

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Re: Questions to send to Roy and co

Thu Sep 10, 2009 7:26 am

SheffieldSaddler wrote:
swiftyboy wrote:
Whitters wrote:Geordie said "Lots of people watching Walsall are stopping doing it - now in 2009 - because its boring, poor value for money, and not entertaining."

And also because depressives like you and your ilk are infecting other fans with your continual whining.



:roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: Open your eyes FFS


Swifty, I wouldnt bother mate. He aint going to open them ever!
:wink:


I can "see" that now Sheff! :D

ShyTallKnight
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Re: Questions to send to Roy and co

Thu Sep 10, 2009 8:24 am

Geordiesaddler wrote:How do you know I wasn't born in the 40's or 50's?

I might not mourn the passing of steam engines, but I do mourn the passing of a railway network we could be proud of, one that actually worked, and one that gave railways to the world.

Likewise I'm proud of the fact that we invented football in this country. Without the enthusiasm and effort of the founders of football, and football clubs what would you "Whitters" have to whitter on about in this newfangled goggledegook modern age?

You are completely entitled to your opinion, but give us some substance rather than just whinging about your opine entitlement!!


Disagree with me all you want, but t least there's something of substance for you to disagree with. What exactly is your point??

Reading your posts is honestly like eating a bowl of fresh air. Take that as an insult if you so wish, I just find it so dissapointing.

Different times, different circumstances. Get over yourself.

So we have to move on do we?? Because the past was rubbish and the future always brings improvements. Who says? And how so??

By the way I'm watching football in the present, its value for money, entertaining and lots of other people are starting to do it.

Lots of people watching Walsall are stopping doing it - now in 2009 - because its boring, poor value for money, and not entertaining.

So who's behind the times and who's up with them?? Its not lost youth that's being yearned for, its lost football clubs, whos various lots have been thrown in withn TV companies and trite so called businessmen. They have warped and perverted football for their own ends and called it progress. It isn't progress in any way shape or form, its crass, unsustainable exploitation. The whole Premiership (God almighty even the self-proclaimed word itself tells you all you need to know), is teetering on the verge of bankrupcy. Show me a Premiership club that isn't massively in debt, or wouldn't be if it wasn't for a rich sugar-daddy, and that's with the billions in prize money, tv dosh and sponsorship rights. None of these businesses are therefore well run, yet the stupid people in the lower leagues (including Conference) Contunue to by and large ape the failed and flawed Premiership model so that they might get their turn on the cash mamory before it finally runs dry. Its unprincipled train wreck stuff, Just ask Oxford United, Bradford City, leeds United, Chester, Luton, Salisbury, Farsley Caltic, Norwich, Southampton, etc etc etc etc. English football is in a monumental mess compared to say 40 years ago when we had a thriving professional game, amature game, and a national side that was world Champions. And by the way 40 years ago, a little club called Walsall, playing in the third division, regularly got gates double and three times what what they get now. There wasn't a "Bonser suite" or a Sunday market, just a football club, and some of the local players that got their chance and honed their craft at humble Fellows Park went on to play for England, never mind Coventry. Now that's somethig to be really proud of.

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aaaae
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Re: Questions to send to Roy and co

Thu Sep 10, 2009 10:41 am

Did you mean to say something there STK?

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Re: Questions to send to Roy and co

Thu Sep 10, 2009 11:08 am

Is it STK or SAN? :wink:

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Re: Questions to send to Roy and co

Thu Sep 10, 2009 12:25 pm

Whitters wrote:Geordie said "Lots of people watching Walsall are stopping doing it - now in 2009 - because its boring, poor value for money, and not entertaining."

And also because depressives like you and your ilk are infecting other fans with your continual whining.


Yeah, 2,000 fans have suddenly stopped going to games because a handful of fans express their discontent on a messageboard.

With reasoning like that a job at the club beckons :roll:

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Re: Questions to send to Roy and co

Thu Sep 10, 2009 12:34 pm

tinned wrote:
Whitters wrote:Geordie said "Lots of people watching Walsall are stopping doing it - now in 2009 - because its boring, poor value for money, and not entertaining."

And also because depressives like you and your ilk are infecting other fans with your continual whining.


Yeah, 2,000 fans have suddenly stopped going to games because a handful of fans express their discontent on a messageboard.

With reasoning like that a job at the club beckons :roll:


:lol:

Facts are Facts. Our attendances are down 2000, and some people blame UTS. I know UTS is a big site, but to suggest its responsible for influencing the opinion of 2000 fans is laughable.

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yoda
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Re: Questions to send to Roy and co

Sat Sep 19, 2009 11:05 am

Can we see Roys response now?

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Re: Questions to send to Roy and co

Sun Sep 27, 2009 1:57 pm

yoda wrote:Can we see Roys response now?

Maybe now even.

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Re: Questions to send to Roy and co

Sun Oct 11, 2009 2:00 am

stonesaddler wrote:
yoda wrote:Can we see Roys response now?

Maybe now even.

I doubt that we will ever see the answers.

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Re: Questions to send to Roy and co

Sun Oct 11, 2009 5:38 am

stonesaddler wrote:
stonesaddler wrote:
yoda wrote:Can we see Roys response now?

Maybe now even.

I doubt that we will ever see the answers.


Copyright being what it is, we've asked for permission to post Roy's letter here in the public forum but haven't had an affirmation, so, funnily enough, we're playing it safe. OK?

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yoda
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Re: Questions to send to Roy and co

Sun Oct 11, 2009 9:35 am

There was me thinking Roy was a public figurehead and spokesman for an organistation we talk about.

I didnt realise we were getting a divorce from him with all these legal papers flying round.

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Re: Questions to send to Roy and co

Sun Oct 11, 2009 11:19 am

Exile wrote:Copyright being what it is, we've asked for permission to post Roy's letter here in the public forum but haven't had an affirmation, so, funnily enough, we're playing it safe. OK?

I think that is a rather over cautious answer.

While there may theoretically be an issue with copyright if one were to print the exact text of the letter, there is absolutely no copyright on paraphrasing and printing the answers in indirect speech.

Example:
If in the actual letter Roy wrote:I think Jeff Bonser is a brilliant boss
. Copyright and if printed without permission there would be a tiny chance of a complaint.

but:
If in a summary someone wrote:Roy said that in his opinion Jeff Bonser was a very good owner
. - No copyright and no grounds for any complaint.

I do not believe that it would be all that hard for anyone to paraphrase the letter and convert it into indirect speech which gives a fair summary of the answers without breaching copyright.

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Re: Questions to send to Roy and co

Sun Oct 11, 2009 12:39 pm

With Royston actually threatening legal action I think it is wise to proceed with extreme caution.

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Re: Questions to send to Roy and co

Sun Oct 11, 2009 1:13 pm

Bernie wrote:I do not believe that it would be all that hard for anyone to paraphrase the letter and convert it into indirect speech which gives a fair summary of the answers without breaching copyright.


The response is quite long and any "paraphrasing" would only be picked apart and the person doing it accused of twisting the words to their own agenda. It'll be much simpler to print the exact response and this will happen as soon as someone from the club replies to the request for permission.

I don't blame the mods for being cautious considering some of the inferences in the response to what were very simple questions.

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Re: Questions to send to Roy and co

Sun Oct 11, 2009 1:20 pm

PJD wrote:With Royston actually threatening legal action I think it is wise to proceed with extreme caution.


Irrespective of any threats he would not be able to bring an action for breach of copyright if someone were to publish a paraphrase of his answers.

There might be issues of breach of confidentiality but unless he could prove that there was a clear agreement not to reveal the content of what was said (such as at the very least if he had written "Private and Confidential" on the letter) there would be no basis for legal action. Even if there were such an agreement Mr Whalley would have to prove he had suffered damage as a result of the breach. Unless the replies contain very sensitive personal or commercial information this seems very unlikely.

The response is quite long and any "paraphrasing" would only be picked apart and the person doing it accused of twisting the words to their own agenda

Producing an accurate precis of a piece of a text used to be a standard part of O-Level English Language. Has that skill disappeared from the curriculum?

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Re: Questions to send to Roy and co

Sun Oct 11, 2009 1:36 pm

PJD wrote:With Royston actually threatening legal action I think it is wise to proceed with extreme caution.


When? Against who and for what?

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Re: Questions to send to Roy and co

Sun Oct 11, 2009 1:49 pm

yoda wrote:
PJD wrote:With Royston actually threatening legal action I think it is wise to proceed with extreme caution.


When? Against who and for what?

In his response to BCS and for libel. If the letter containing this threat had been sent to you, you'd be cautious too I would guess. I know I would.

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Re: Questions to send to Roy and co

Sun Oct 11, 2009 2:10 pm

PJD wrote:
yoda wrote:
PJD wrote:With Royston actually threatening legal action I think it is wise to proceed with extreme caution.


When? Against who and for what?

In his response to BCS and for libel. If the letter containing this threat had been sent to you, you'd be cautious too I would guess. I know I would.


Well as I am the one in the firing line so to speak, those are pretty much my exact thoughts on the issue - I am glad you have spoken up for me there mate - thanks for seeing my side side.

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Re: Questions to send to Roy and co

Sun Oct 11, 2009 3:05 pm

so as long as roy pays a fiver, views the letter on fouts,then he can do you for copy rights,so you are baceing your back covering on roy not spending a fiver :?:

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