Brentford (A) League One - 24 Aug 2013

[Registered Saddler]

if we keep conceding cheap and easy goals like we are doing then we are going to create problems for ourselves! We seem to be content to keep allowing crosses coming into the box yet not dealing with them.

And it's the second one we've conceded by Baxendale not closing down the crosser.

[JonnyOwen]

if we keep conceding cheap and easy goals like we are doing then we are going to create problems for ourselves! We seem to be content to keep allowing crosses coming into the box yet not dealing with them.

And it's the second one we've conceded by Baxendale not closing down the crosser.

Yep, and for this reason I would be tempted to play with him in the centre behind Westcarr with Lalkovic in his wide position next game. If that doesn't work then he either needs some proper 1 to 1 training or we bring in Julian Gray to play there.

[Sadders]

The only issues we have are the fact we have 3 number 10's and no right wingers and we also need a true finisher otherwise we are a perfectly good side at this level put together on a shoe string 23rd worst budget, that create, attack and do all the defensive basics as well as anybody at this level. County fans said we were good, Oldham the best side to play them this season and Brentford fans were VERY complimentary on their site after the game especially about Butler and our free flowing football. I honestly, think there's no reason to be negative, we are a centre forward away from a 6th finish and a comfy mid table side who are exciting to watch without one.

http://www.griffinpark.org/forums/showt ... 849&page=5

[Magic Man Fan]

Plan B is desperately needed. That's two teams that have woked out that if they close us down, we don't have a plan b, without the individual brilliance of Brandy or Paterson. Worrying, as it wont be long before other league one managers start talking and spreading the word.

Julian Gray used to be able to create something from nothing, is worth another go in my book.

In the meantime, Sawyers needs to be starting and playing higher up the pitch, as he's the only one that can do the Grigg role.

[We-ARE-Walsall]

The only issues we have are the fact we have 3 number 10's and no right wingers and we also need a true finisher otherwise we are a perfectly good side at this level put together on a shoe string 23rd worst budget, that create, attack and do all the defensive basics as well as anybody at this level. County fans said we were good, Oldham the best side to play them this season and Brentford fans were VERY complimentary on their site after the game especially about Butler and our free flowing football. I honestly, think there's no reason to be negative, we are a centre forward away from a 6th finish and a comfy mid table side who are exciting to watch without one.

http://www.griffinpark.org/forums/showt ... 849&page=5

:lol: I agree with you, but at the same time I am laughing because the problems you highlighted are quite big when you think about it.

We are overloaded for "in the hole" position. Westcarr, Baxendale, and possibly Sawyers all play best there. Baxendale is no winger, although he is doing a decent job there, he is wasted there. If Westcarr plays center forward all season we will struggle.

I don't think we need a "finisher" as such, although it would be nice obviously. We as MMF said need someone to do what Grigg did. He scored around 11 goals from open play, but he added a whole lot more to our team and we are missing him badly. I tend to agree with him also, out of what we have got Sawyers is about the best bet we have as at least he would make the ball stick.

Smith needs to work out some balance to our forward line somehow, either with what we have got, or by bringing someone in, because things are not quite right as they are. Although as you say we still are a decent side.

[ride the lightning]

I thought on the basis of the first half we were slightly fortunate to go in 1-0 up but over the whole game we deserved the win.

I was pretty impressed with Walsall, quick to close down and good passing football.Very strong in at the back esp Butler but unfortunately not so great upfront..Lalkovic missed a really good chance at the end of the first half when presented with a clear shot 18 yards from goal and Button made a good save near the end but as I was up the other end of the ground didn't get a great view.

Your keeper was very good, a couple of good saves in the second half and came off his line well.

Defo think you will finish top 8 and you were twice the side those cloggers from Bramall Lane were last week..the difference could be if you get a striker in....

[rogerem]

There has to be a Striker out there who we could grab for a couple of hundred grand hasn't there? This surely has to be good business, surely? The championship awaits,or at least a few quid in extra gate receipts?

[Cully]

Perhaps we should resurrect this thread helpfully started by Mystic.


viewtopic.php?f=2&t=43148

Perhaps Dean Smith could play Captain Marvellous for 90 minutes as our number 1 striker? Giving the guy an occasional 3 or 4 minutes upfront every time we're losing is not very fair in my mind, Baxendale or Hemmings could probably cover for him, they must be a shoe in for the centre half position.

Come on Dean, sort it out :idea:

[chestersaddler]

Perhaps we should resurrect this thread helpfully started by Mystic.


viewtopic.php?f=2&t=43148

Perhaps Dean Smith could play Captain Marvellous for 90 minutes as our number 1 striker? Giving the guy an occasional 3 or 4 minutes upfront every time we're losing is not very fair in my mind, Baxendale or Hemmings could probably cover for him, they must be a shoe in for the centre half position.

Come on Dean, sort it out :idea:

He's off :D

[Cully]

Perhaps we should resurrect this thread helpfully started by Mystic.


viewtopic.php?f=2&t=43148

Perhaps Dean Smith could play Captain Marvellous for 90 minutes as our number 1 striker? Giving the guy an occasional 3 or 4 minutes upfront every time we're losing is not very fair in my mind, Baxendale or Hemmings could probably cover for him, they must be a shoe in for the centre half position.

Come on Dean, sort it out :idea:

He's off :D

PERIOD :arrow:

:D

[Aldridge_saddler]

There has to be a Striker out there who we could grab for a couple of hundred grand hasn't there? This surely has to be good business, surely? The championship awaits,or at least a few quid in extra gate receipts?

Where is that money coming from?

[gray]

I would like to ask the ones that went.Had will Grigg played No 9 for us yesterday could the result have been in our favour,or a point maybe?

I think it could have been yes.

We played well in the 2nd half. The pressure and the tempo was very good and the passing was excellent. We didn't test their goalkeeper enough though.

[rogerem]

There has to be a Striker out there who we could grab for a couple of hundred grand hasn't there? This surely has to be good business, surely? The championship awaits,or at least a few quid in extra gate receipts?

Where is that money coming from?

Really As? Go on then i'll pretend you don't know. :wink:
As strikers are much harder to find, with what we have and what's to come, a bit of quality bought for a couple of hundred grand isn't too much to expect, is it?

[Exile]

There has to be a Striker out there who we could grab for a couple of hundred grand hasn't there? This surely has to be good business, surely? The championship awaits,or at least a few quid in extra gate receipts?

Where is that money coming from?

Brentford's wallet. :wink:

[NEWPORT SADDLERS DAD]

There has to be a Striker out there who we could grab for a couple of hundred grand hasn't there? This surely has to be good business, surely? The championship awaits,or at least a few quid in extra gate receipts?

Where is that money coming from?

Didn't we sell Patterson.

[Aldridge_saddler]

Yes we did.

But a) We dont know how much we got upfront
b) didn't we spend a massive chunk of money on the youth set up? (250K+?)
c) We have an extra £100k to find for policing

So I'd expect far less than £250k to be left even if we could spend it on a fee.

[Magic Man Fan]

I think people are forgetting there is still debt to clear.

[WFC_Rob]

Not sure I agree with the suggestions that Sawyers should be playing up front. His strengths lie in his ability to find space and pick a pass. Playing with his back to goal will require him to change the way he plays his game one hell of a lot, in my opinion.

I was never a big advocate of this suggestion before, but given the personnel we have available, I do wonder whether Westcarr playing up front is the best answer. We then play Lalkovic wide (right or left) and either Baxendale or Sawyers 'in the hole'.

We'd potentially be solving a lot of problems by signing a striker, but until we do, it's a case of needs must.

[latviancheese]

Wait for ittttt........


Wait........


"WE NEED A TARGET MAN"


Its a fair point we lack a little balance though.

[Magic Man Fan]

Not sure I agree with the suggestions that Sawyers should be playing up front. His strengths lie in his ability to find space and pick a pass. Playing with his back to goal will require him to change the way he plays his game one hell of a lot, in my opinion.

I was never a big advocate of this suggestion before, but given the personnel we have available, I do wonder whether Westcarr playing up front is the best answer. We then play Lalkovic wide (right or left) and either Baxendale or Sawyers 'in the hole'.

We'd potentially be solving a lot of problems by signing a striker, but until we do, it's a case of needs must.

I agree about Sawyers strengths, but until we acquire someone else more suitable, it think he's the best option, unless Hewitt gets a chance.

Tongue in cheek I know latvian, but it is required. It doesn't have to be a giant lump, because Grigg played the targetman role well, by runnjng the channels and being able to hold the ball up when it was played to him.

A big man to ruffle the feathers of defenders, tire them out, and give the others more opportunities wouldn't be a bad thing though.

Its either that or play with proper wingers, to hit low crosses to tap in, but we're doing neither at the moment.

[Surrey Saddler]

Pretty simple in my book: we have lost our three best players from last season and havn't replaced them.

[Wyrley_saddler]

I agree about the balance of the team is wayward. Can't fault Baxendale for his effort but he's ineffective for 95% of the match when he's on the wing. Definitely need a right winger, or to play Lalkovic out there with Hemmings on the left. We also do need another striker. Hewitt is our only 'proper' first team striker and whilst I appreciate he hasn't seen much action yet, he looks distinctly average at best. Westcarr is definitely not the answer up top and I think we'd take so much away from Sawyers game if he played up there.

I believe we'd be better to line up up top with:
--------------new striker---------
Hemmings---Sawyers---Laklovic

As for replacing Grigg, Brandy and Pato, I agree we haven't adequately replaced them. Grigg was the easiest to replace, but the fact we've signed one striker who has barely played any football league games isn't good enough. As for Pato and Brandy, they are players who are almost irreplaceable on our budget as unless you bring them through or find a gem (like we did with Brandy) as they cost an arm and a leg. Lalkovic is half way to replacing one of them.

[Magic Man Fan]

Pretty simple in my book: we have lost our three best players from last season and havn't replaced them.

Not true. Smith just hasn't worked out who should play where, or what system. We seem to have too many in between position players.

I also think teams have worked us out. That was the quality of Brandy, and to a certain extent, Paterson, because they were so unpredictable. They didn't know what they were going to do themselves, let alone the defender.

We've bought in good players, but they're not as tricky as those that have left, which is why Smith needs a rethink about how we're going to play. We could always sign Mark Wright back.

[We-ARE-Walsall]

I agree about the balance of the team is wayward. Can't fault Baxendale for his effort but he's ineffective for 95% of the match when he's on the wing. Definitely need a right winger, or to play Lalkovic out there with Hemmings on the left. We also do need another striker. Hewitt is our only 'proper' first team striker and whilst I appreciate he hasn't seen much action yet, he looks distinctly average at best. Westcarr is definitely not the answer up top and I think we'd take so much away from Sawyers game if he played up there.

I believe we'd be better to line up up top with:
--------------new striker---------
Hemmings---Sawyers---Laklovic

As for replacing Grigg, Brandy and Pato, I agree we haven't adequately replaced them. Grigg was the easiest to replace, but the fact we've signed one striker who has barely played any football league games isn't good enough. As for Pato and Brandy, they are players who are almost irreplaceable on our budget as unless you bring them through or find a gem (like we did with Brandy) as they cost an arm and a leg. Lalkovic is half way to replacing one of them.

I think that is a pretty good post. I can't believe he hasn't thought about trying Lalkovic out wide yet, he really needs to hope he can fit in to that role, because he sure as hell wont ever be able to play in the center (unless it was in a 4-4-2 with someone next to him) He just isn't good enough at that role for various reasons. He has some pace, he may be able to play the wide role.

Then in my opinion they need to Baxendale free "in the hole" With either Sawyers or Westcarr as the main striker. Both Westcarr and Sawyers are probably better at the "in the hole" role too, but it's a case of getting on with what we have got. Possibly a bit more thought could have gone in to this by Smith. I am sure we can get it to work, at least better than it is, but the first job is to write Lalkovic off as the focal point of 3 up front, never going to work.

I do also agree that Brandy and Paterson were almost impossible to replace, Paterson even more so than Brandy. One thing Paterson would do that none of our current set up are either willing to do, or are capable of doing well is have a pop from distance. I still think Grigg is missed a lot more than people think too, he was a huge part of how we played. I thought we had signed Hewitt to fill that gap, but apparently Smith doesn't think he is good enough ?

[Sadders]

Poeple are being overally critical of the players we've brought in, not every single group of players are going to merge and quickly become a promotion threat at this level especially when the players you bring in are pretty much cheap, young lads with a point to prove who may or may not go on to be successful. What Smith has done in my mind is seen that we use a front 4, compiled of 3 attacking midfielders and 1 central striker. I think Smith has brought in Sawyers, Hewitt, Lalkovic and kept Baxo/Hemmings so that in his mind we have plenty of options and a wide variety of skills in each position. For example in Smith's mind, Lalkovic can play wide, as a number 10 or a number 9, Sawyers can play on either wing or in the hole, Hewitt is the central striker, Baxendale can play in the hole or as a winger, Hemmings can play on either wing and Westcarr could play as a number 10 in the hole or a number 9.

Sadly that has up and down sides to it, the up side is that we are versatile and with a small club, small budget players who can play in versatile positions are fantastic to have on the books but on the downside we are left to shoehorn players into different positions here there and everywhere and thus, we don't have out and out proper players in certain positions. We don't have a proper number 9 that can hold play up and poach as Macken, Grigg and Ricketts have done over the years, we have 3 players who should be playing in the hole (Westcarr, Baxendale and Sawyers) and no proper right winger. I think we'd be best using Lalkovic to play wide right, but I get the feeling he came to play upfront under Chelsea's orders and Smith is reluctant to play him elsewhere purely down to the entire 'relationship' building thing with Chelsea's youngsters. I also think Smith feels leaving certain players out may hamper their progress, Baxendale for example - he isn't a right winger by tradition or nature, but from what I've seen this season I'd rather play Sawyers in the hole, Lalkovic wide and leave Westcarr on the bench, but that then means the player we've just forked out a 3 year deal on doesn't start games and wil quickly become uninterested and pissed off.

I still think the future is very bright, we have a very good team who are an addition or 2 away from breaking into a play off place and surprising football fans up and down the country. I think Smith is doing a great job and we have created our own brand of attractive pretty football which, even if not bringing in the best results at times is so much better to watch than the previous 5-6 years of drivel we've seen. The money we have received in the summer has gone some way to boosting coffers and will give us leeway to sign the likes of Lalkovic on loan from top premier league clubs whilst not over-spending and focusing in on producing some quality footballing youth players in the years to come to ensure the future is bright.

Just ask yourself this, if you took a look at our starting 11 2-3 years ago, when we'd hit that wall of lowering attendances, a terrible budget, no connection between club and fans, a never ending spree of ageing journeyman players and literally no hope of anything but a relegation dogfight season after season where would you rather be, there or here?


It's a no brainer.

UTS.