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Tranmere (a) - 20//11/12 - League 1

Reports and reaction from the 2012-2013 season as Walsall finished 9th in League 1
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Aldridge_saddler
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Re: Tranmere (a) - 20//11/12 - League 1

Tue Nov 20, 2012 9:40 pm

Delighted. Clean sheet... Question is do we bring butler back?

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Re: Tranmere (a) - 20//11/12 - League 1

Tue Nov 20, 2012 9:40 pm

BathSaddler wrote:A good point tonight and a clean sheet!

A home win on Saturday now please.


I wish we were playing away every week

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Re: Tranmere (a) - 20//11/12 - League 1

Tue Nov 20, 2012 9:40 pm

Great point on paper, sounds like we could have had all 3.

UTS

Lets waste Hartlepool on sat.

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Re: Tranmere (a) - 20//11/12 - League 1

Tue Nov 20, 2012 9:41 pm

Stunned, expected two heavy defeats, and got two points, totally unexpected after recent turgid times, well done lads, keep up the good work and lets climb up the table towards the 'haven' of mid table mediocrity!!

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Re: Tranmere (a) - 20//11/12 - League 1

Tue Nov 20, 2012 9:43 pm

The clean sheet is the main thing. At last.

I think we can put Hartlepool to the sword on Saturday. Probably will do so as well, as I'm missing this one.

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Re: Tranmere (a) - 20//11/12 - League 1

Tue Nov 20, 2012 9:44 pm

A point where we're all but written off? I'll take that. Thanks, and well done the lads.

[cully mode] they obviously ignored Deano's advice [/cully mode]

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Re: Tranmere (a) - 20//11/12 - League 1

Tue Nov 20, 2012 9:44 pm

Ancient Moaner wrote:
DonningtonSaddler wrote:We can win this!!

1 - 3 Paterson, Brandy, Bowerman


Can I have some of what you are on please???

have to agree with above post, 3-0 to Trampmere without doubt.


Based on a decent keeper who instills confidence, Brandy playing to his potential and J Chambers left on the bench. A surefire recipe for a return to early season form (still need a big striker though). Therefore, my prediction was based on some insight rather than unmitigated doom-mongery! Should have won that one. Roll on Hartlepools!!!

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Re: Tranmere (a) - 20//11/12 - League 1

Tue Nov 20, 2012 9:46 pm

Aldridge_saddler wrote:Delighted. Clean sheet... Question is do we bring butler back?



Beat me to it....

simply answer is NO, When Downing has played he has done well and looks very capable. After failing to keep a clean sheet you would be mental to change a defence that has just kept one but having said that Dean Smith is our manager and in alot of quarters Butler is a 'badge kissing chest thumping hero'

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Re: Tranmere (a) - 20//11/12 - League 1

Tue Nov 20, 2012 9:48 pm

LLLLDLDDLLLDD - PERIOD

Smith out

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Re: Tranmere (a) - 20//11/12 - League 1

Tue Nov 20, 2012 10:03 pm

Good point away to Tranmere, no doubt about it, shame Grigg decided he wasn't going to score tonight though, only frustrating thing of the night.

We desperately need a win under out belt though, and Saturday should be the one against a gash Hartlepool side.....fudge, I'm getting ahead of myself aren't I? :lol:

I'd leave Butler out too, he doesn't deserve to dive straight back in anyway, (some super fans might disagree considering he is of course the best League One defender around) and the Holden - Butler partnership is utterly atrocious and blatantly doesn't work seeing as they are both the same slow clogger type of CB, Downing to carry on in the side, he looks solid enough to me.

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Re: Tranmere (a) - 20//11/12 - League 1

Tue Nov 20, 2012 10:15 pm

After 51 years as a Saddlerette (woman, girl and embryo) .......... one has learned that one does not count ones chickens till the egg is well out of the chicken's nethers...................... the last 2 games have shown progress apparently..................... enthusiasm and bullishness is all well and good in its place (or if we supported Man U or AC Milan), but this is the Saddlers! Be realistic lads - lets not get ahead of ourselves. Thereby lays disappointment, unhappiness and sad to say on this here message board............ total over reaction. However - if at 5.50pm (12.50pm EST) we stuffed 5 past the Hartle's then I shall be as happy and bullish as the next sufferer.

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Re: Tranmere (a) - 20//11/12 - League 1

Tue Nov 20, 2012 10:17 pm

newjersey exile wrote:After 51 years as a Saddlerette (woman, girl and embryo) .......... one has learned that one does not count ones chickens till the egg is well out of the chicken's nethers...................... the last 2 games have shown progress apparently..................... enthusiasm and bullishness is all well and good in its place (or if we supported Man U or AC Milan), but this is the Saddlers! Be realistic lads - lets not get ahead of ourselves. Thereby lays disappointment, unhappiness and sad to say on this here message board............ total over reaction. However - if at 5.50pm (12.50pm EST) we stuffed 5 past the Hartle's then I shall be as happy and bullish as the next sufferer.


... . ..... . .. . .. .... .

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Re: Tranmere (a) - 20//11/12 - League 1

Tue Nov 20, 2012 10:43 pm

Cully wrote:LLLLDLDDLLLDD - PERIOD

Smith out



Other teams appear to have W in their sequence, what does it mean, and why don't we have any? :lol:

We aren't going to sack Smith, not saying I disagree with you, but it's just not going to happen.

Butler will be straight back in on Saturday, but there is no way he should be. He can kiss his badge from the bench.

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Re: Tranmere (a) - 20//11/12 - League 1

Tue Nov 20, 2012 10:57 pm

God knows how we didn't win that tonight. We murdered them for most of the night and could of scored a hatfull. Grigg played the best I have seen him play for ages, until he got near goal. He should of scored a couple at least, particularly the one on one in the first half. He caused them no end of problems all night though.

Referee and linesman were complete baffoons, one stone wall penalty in the second half for hand ball and one that looked a possible penalty when Grigg was pulled down in first half but it was down the far end so could not really tell.

Whole team deserve credit tonight. Best I have seen us play for ages. Really disappointed not to have won and that tells its own story away from home against the top of the league side, even if they were total cack :D

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Re: Tranmere (a) - 20//11/12 - League 1

Tue Nov 20, 2012 11:03 pm

Played well tonight, deserved a point at the very least. Don't know how Tranmere are top of the league, they just played hoofball all night.
The referee was atrocious - first half we shoudl have had a penalty and a free kick down their end, second half their defender blatantly handballed it in the area, and we only got a corner. Also, he booked Brandy for playing on when he was caught offside, which was a bit harsh seen as though FB and their defender both played on with their back to the ref, and clearly didnt hear his whistle.

Keeper - played well. Quick to come out for balls and calling for the defender to leave it. Didnt have that many saves to make.
Taundry - first half defended well, poor going foward/passing. second half, some sloppy mistakes at the back but better going foward.
Holden - played really well.
Downing - poor first half in my opinion. Not sure how he missed scoring an own goal. Bloody lucky :) great tackle in the second half to deny a certain goal though.
Taylor - average. A lot of misplaced passes in the first half.
Paterson - same old. Some good stuff, but why do our wingers prefer to run across the pitch rather than foward with the ball?
Mantom - quiet. Was not on the ball a lot.
Featherstone - played well too. Either him or Grigg, or Holden for Motm for me.
Hemmings - same as Paterson, but quieter. Looked livlier in the second half.
Grigg - Played brilliantly first half, apart from missing 3 or 4 chances. Had the beating of their centre back every time in the first half. Worked hard all night.
Brandy - looked lively in parts. Caused their defenders a few problems. Would have taken him off earlier, you could see he was feeling his thigh from Saturday just after the break

Subs - didnt really have time to do a lot.

Dean Smith - why take Grigg off for Chambers with only injury time left. He'd played well all night, and looked most likely to score, no need to go 4-5-1 for 4 minutes. Only criticism for him tonight.

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Re: Tranmere (a) - 20//11/12 - League 1

Tue Nov 20, 2012 11:18 pm

I'd put Butler back in the team in place of Holden. Agree that Downing should keep his place and believe that Butler is a better version of Holden, but very similar in style. Think it's possibly the blend of a young, quicker defender alongside a more experienced defender that made the difference rather than the personnel necessarily.

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Re: Tranmere (a) - 20//11/12 - League 1

Tue Nov 20, 2012 11:24 pm

Agree with what Cumbria has posted there to be honest.

We played well tonight and looked much more like a team. We showed great determination and can't really criticise anyone, they all did well.
Thought the new keeper was very reassuring, loud, on the ball and quick to things, and this showed in the defence, as they were happy to play it back to him when needed. Holden had a great game and took the captain's armband and role on very well. His partnership with Downing looked good, and I'd agree that maybe Butler doesn't need to come back in. Holden was that man tonight.
Grigg was excellent up front. Won the number of headers you'd expect but held the ball up excellently and seemed to link with Brandy well, who also looked lively and gave their lumbering centre halves the run around at times. The ref was a twonk and let Brandy and Grigg get bashed around all night by their centre halves. He finally booked one in the centre half.

As mentioned Grigg should have done much better with some chances, particularly the 1 on 1. He also should have squared to Brandy when he chose to shoot from a hard angle instead. Hemmings looked like he was interested tonight. Got up and down the pitch well and supported the play.

The only couple of things I noticed were we seem reluctant to cross a ball into the box at times - maybe becuase we have no-one to aim at in there who will win the header or be a threat. There are times when we need more presence on the pitch, and I don't just mean up front. Some more experience in one or two positions would be really helpful (as we all know!) as we link up well going forwards at times, but then don't seem to know what to do on the edge of the box at times.

Overall a very pleasing performance, we had some great spells of pressure in the Tranmere half and it looked like everyone had 'pulled their socks up' after recent dismal performances. If one team deserved to win, it was us, but a point there was no mean feat. Well done lads.

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Re: Tranmere (a) - 20//11/12 - League 1

Tue Nov 20, 2012 11:28 pm

lichsaddler wrote:I'd put Butler back in the team in place of Holden. Agree that Downing should keep his place and believe that Butler is a better version of Holden, but very similar in style. Think it's possibly the blend of a young, quicker defender alongside a more experienced defender that made the difference rather than the personnel necessarily.


On the evidence of tonight, I don't think I would. As mentioned in my previous post, Holden played the Butler role very well. He looked composed (only made one iffy pass across to Downing which luckily didn't lead to anything) and won lots against their forwards. He looked very determined and lead the back line well. Seemed to have a good understanding with McCarey as well. Don't remember him giving away any silly fouls either, which Butler has a habit of doing.

It wouldn't surprise me to see Butler back in at the weekend, but Holden and Downing did very well together and for one to miss out would be harsh on them.

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Re: Tranmere (a) - 20//11/12 - League 1

Tue Nov 20, 2012 11:41 pm

lichsaddler wrote:I'd put Butler back in the team in place of Holden. Agree that Downing should keep his place and believe that Butler is a better version of Holden, but very similar in style. Think it's possibly the blend of a young, quicker defender alongside a more experienced defender that made the difference rather than the personnel necessarily.



I wouldn't argue with that. I have no real problem with Butler, he is what he is. A very limited defender, but plays with his heart and soul. Really needs someone who can do a bit of covering for him, as he tends to attack the ball early, and gets caught out a fair bit. The only reason I would have gone with Holden in front of him Saturday is cos we kept a clean sheet tonight. Holden and Butler can not play together it is blatantly obvious, and as you rightly say , Butler is the better of the two.

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Re: Tranmere (a) - 20//11/12 - League 1

Tue Nov 20, 2012 11:43 pm

[ignorant mode] How about with a sweeper? [/ignorant mode]

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Re: Tranmere (a) - 20//11/12 - League 1

Tue Nov 20, 2012 11:58 pm

It's 1 of thoose either way decisions to bring Butler back in or not. On 1 hand it's only our second cleansheet of the season tonight so we'd be foolish to break a partnership that has accomplished that I'd probably bring him back in. Downing, Butler or Holden - best defender? Butler over Holden comfortably and probably over a younger player in Downing to. In our other cleansheet this season a back 4 of, Chambers, Butler, Holden and Taylor played away at County, since then combinations of that defence haven't kept a cleansheet, so keeping Butler out of the side doesn't necessarily mean we'l keep another on Saturday.

Butler is the captain, is the most senior of the players, has the best leadership abilities and gives it his absolute everything (despite being a league 1 clogger, with limited or no footballing ability, generally a little pace-lacking and sometimes quick to give silly fouls away). He's earnt us many, many more points that he's lost us. Just a few weeks ago he took all his experience at Bury to cover the goal-line and saved a certain goal.

He's the captain for a reason, he's been quality since he's been here and If I'm honest, good or bad tonight Holden is a poor centre back who brings Butler down with him as they are very similar with Butler being obviously better than Holden. I really dont understand why Butler/Downing didn't stay as our CB partnering after Holden got sent off against Sheffield United - he's the weaklink in the defence and his last 2 teams and the way they played suggested that to.

Rochdale - released and relegated from league 1
Chesterfield - dropped from a team sitting 24th and released mid-season.

It's no co-incidence.

Glad of a point tonight, can't help but feel it'd have been perfect to nick a winner with Orient, Bury, Oldham and Shrewsbury all stealing wins tonight that closens the gap to the bottom four. A big few weeks for Smith and the team coming up, Hartlepool in a must win game, a local game with Coventry before back to back home games against Colchester and Yeovil. Win 3 out of 4 and we are firmly back in a good mid-season position. Take 1 win and 3 defeats, or even 1 point from the lot and you'd think he'l have to be walking soon.

Fair play to DS though, dropped both the Chambers brothers and brought back in Hemmings who was under-fire, gave Brandy a go upfront who hasn't scored in years and all of a sudden we seem to have a bit of confidence again. With Flo potentially back Saturday - are things finally looking up again? We'l see.
Last edited by Sadders on Wed Nov 21, 2012 12:01 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Tranmere (a) - 20//11/12 - League 1

Wed Nov 21, 2012 12:01 am

Encouraging. But I'm totally going to resign if we lose against the monkey rapists.

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Re: Tranmere (a) - 20//11/12 - League 1

Wed Nov 21, 2012 12:02 am

I had the unusual experience of sitting in the main stand at the side of the goal with the Tranmere fans today and got a different perspective.

I was having a chat with a lot of them through the game and they were very impressed by Will Grigg (as was I) and Brandy. They also liked Featherstone.

We were very organised today and pushed very high up on Tranmere. Tranmere were very poor and hardly created anything.

These two draws are wasted if we don't beat Hartlepool at home Saturday.

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Re: Tranmere (a) - 20//11/12 - League 1

Wed Nov 21, 2012 12:24 am

bangsection wrote:Encouraging. But I'm totally going to resign if we lose against the monkey rapists.

I shouldn't speak for everyone, but I would say we're all up for another public resignation and the pages and pages of comment they bring.
Didn't they just hang the primate?
Very good point at Tranmere.
You don't normally go to Birkenhead and come out with anything.

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Re: Tranmere (a) - 20//11/12 - League 1

Wed Nov 21, 2012 12:30 am

2 good performances/results. Team spirit back at last.

We need to roast pool Saturday

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Re: Tranmere (a) - 20//11/12 - League 1

Wed Nov 21, 2012 12:51 am

Just got back to Huddersfield from the game.

First of all, how they are top of the league with that performance I'll never know. We outplayed them for most of the game and apart from a 20 minute period in the 2nd half, they never really looked like scoring. They made a number of critical defensive errors that we should of capitalised on and on another day, would have scored from. They couldn't deal with a number of our long balls and gave the ball away throughout the match.

Don't let that take away from our performance though - tonight I enjoyed watching a much more attack-minded team who looked like they really wanted to win the game (the last game I saw was at Sincil Bank). McCarey didn't have a lot to do but commanded his area with great communication and bravely collected the ball from the air, including at the edge of his box. Grigg was fantastic and as Mick said, could easily have got a hattrick.

Overall, we played very well and I left feeling we could have easily won it but still delighted with the result, and pleased to have finally seen a spirited performance from the lads. I just hope this continues on Saturday, and with both Butler and Flo back in the team we shouldn't have any problems.

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Re: Tranmere (a) - 20//11/12 - League 1

Wed Nov 21, 2012 7:22 am

All sounds very promising for Saturday, can't wait to add that W.

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Re: Tranmere (a) - 20//11/12 - League 1

Wed Nov 21, 2012 8:09 am

This is disappointing......Walsall go to the top of the table team and by all accounts play well and come away with a draw. Thread is only 3 pages long.

Walsall play terribly (Scunthorpe / Lincoln etc.) and thread goes to 10-11 pages....hmmmm I think it shows what a great "online therapeutic service" UTS offers when we want to let off steam :D

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Re: Tranmere (a) - 20//11/12 - League 1

Wed Nov 21, 2012 8:25 am

The defence looked generally very solid last night, apart from a couple of kamikaze passes. Holden played his role well but I think the fact they had a commanding and confident keeper behind them made a huge difference. The defence had confidence in him and it showed.

Tin Tin in :D

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Re: Tranmere (a) - 20//11/12 - League 1

Wed Nov 21, 2012 9:30 am

Super Gabor wrote:This is disappointing......Walsall go to the top of the table team and by all accounts play well and come away with a draw. Thread is only 3 pages long.

Walsall play terribly (Scunthorpe / Lincoln etc.) and thread goes to 10-11 pages....hmmmm I think it shows what a great "online therapeutic service" UTS offers when we want to let off steam :D


Never mind that, this upsurge in form threatens to ruin my plan to abseil from the top of the Blue Pop stand on Saturday unveiling a huge "I resign" banner.

:-(

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