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Hartlepool United (H) League 1 Saturday 10/3/12.

Reports and reaction from the 2011-2012 season as Walsall finished 19th in League 1
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Darth Vader
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Re: Hartlepool United (H) League 1 Saturday 10/3/12.

Sat Mar 10, 2012 6:43 pm

ihatethecorps wrote:Can anyone explain why Will Grigg is still at the club and how he still manages to steal a place on the bench? This bloke is awful with an even worse footballing brain.

One of our best chances today (not many too choose from) was when he picked up a loose ball at the edge of the box, and from an almost impossible angle decides hes going to shoot, not only that but its on his weaker right (left not much better) foot. All he had to do was hold the ball up, have a look round and see Macken was free 20yrds out.

Im sure he spends more time picking himself up off the ground after tripping himself up all the time. :evil:

P.s A missed opportunity to get 3 points today, but fair play to 'Pool, it was almost the perfect defensive away performance with Grof producing a good block from a rare attack to keep it at 0-0, 1 point is better than none.


Thought Grigg was pretty decent when he came on myself.

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Re: Hartlepool United (H) League 1 Saturday 10/3/12.

Sat Mar 10, 2012 6:45 pm

Absolute non-event , very poor............( Cavalier excepted ).


Match highlight ............shaking Sniffer's hand.


Back to the ranks of stayaway.

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Re: Hartlepool United (H) League 1 Saturday 10/3/12.

Sat Mar 10, 2012 6:50 pm

Four Oaks Saddler wrote:Chambers on for Macken - interesting. :?


Just about sums up Smiths tactical nous; ie take off our two best strikers and put on the midfield maestro Chambers to consolidate our lack of attacking play and significantly increase our percentage of 'awful back passes to anybody who is behind him' ratio or give the ball to Butler so he can launch it forward with the confidence that nobody in a Walsall shirt will be anywhere near it.

Disappointing but hey ho we're unbeaten and I'm still not making some pointless illogical 'stay away' stance.

:D

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Re: Hartlepool United (H) League 1 Saturday 10/3/12.

Sat Mar 10, 2012 6:52 pm

ihatethecorps wrote:Can anyone explain why Will Grigg is still at the club and how he still manages to steal a place on the bench? This bloke is awful with an even worse footballing brain.

One of our best chances today (not many too choose from) was when he picked up a loose ball at the edge of the box, and from an almost impossible angle decides hes going to shoot, not only that but its on his weaker right (left not much better) foot. All he had to do was hold the ball up, have a look round and see Macken was free 20yrds out.

Im sure he spends more time picking himself up off the ground after tripping himself up all the time. :evil:

P.s A missed opportunity to get 3 points today, but fair play to 'Pool, it was almost the perfect defensive away performance with Grof producing a good block from a rare attack to keep it at 0-0, 1 point is better than none.


What are you on about you moron???

Firstly he did well when he came on until he got an injury after colliding with the keeper.

Secondly, the chance was brought about by his pchasing and it was on his right foot from a very tight angle with nobody around him!! Sure you aren't on about bower man???

Maybe open your eyes next time you clown :roll:

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Re: Hartlepool United (H) League 1 Saturday 10/3/12.

Sat Mar 10, 2012 6:54 pm

Darth Vader wrote:
ihatethecorps wrote:Can anyone explain why Will Grigg is still at the club and how he still manages to steal a place on the bench? This bloke is awful with an even worse footballing brain.

One of our best chances today (not many too choose from) was when he picked up a loose ball at the edge of the box, and from an almost impossible angle decides hes going to shoot, not only that but its on his weaker right (left not much better) foot. All he had to do was hold the ball up, have a look round and see Macken was free 20yrds out.

Im sure he spends more time picking himself up off the ground after tripping himself up all the time. :evil:

P.s A missed opportunity to get 3 points today, but fair play to 'Pool, it was almost the perfect defensive away performance with Grof producing a good block from a rare attack to keep it at 0-0, 1 point is better than none.


Thought Grigg was pretty decent when he came on myself.



Chambers again showed us why he's so poor when he came on, and cant understand why Smith persists with him, ok he's been out for afew games but when he did come on it was 1 missed pass after another, and also hes got the touch of a rapist.

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Re: Hartlepool United (H) League 1 Saturday 10/3/12.

Sat Mar 10, 2012 6:54 pm

Sadders wrote:Thought that was an average performance, didnt help ourselves by launching the ball, but they played 4-5-1 with a deep sitting defender which didnt allow us to open the game up, get flo on the ball or really create anything along the floor. We then resorted to hoofing to strikers that can't win headers. Hartlepool were one of the worst and most cynical football teams i've seen for a very long time. 1 upfront, hoofball, lots of headers lots of launches to safety, 3 deep lying midfielders. They have nothing to play for FFS why didnt they just come and have a go. At least Yeovil and Wednesday wont sit deep in the next 2 games giving us a chance to create a bit more and utilise flo.

Butler was MOTM for me, Smith didnt win half as many headers as he did.

Mantom was anonymous and is lightweight, Cuvelier had a job done on him.

If i'd paid petrol costs and £20 to be entertained all the way from Hartlepool i'd be disgraced on the back of that performance.

Totally concur about the monkey hangers. They stopped us playing (fairly by stopping Flo) and cynically by kicking/pulling back anything that got past them. In this, they were abetted by a complete excuse of a referee who let them get away with it.

On another day, we'd have got the scrappy 1-0 win we deserved. That's life - I'd settle for the position we have now compared to where I thought we'd be 6 games ago.

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Re: Hartlepool United (H) League 1 Saturday 10/3/12.

Sat Mar 10, 2012 6:58 pm

fatboyslim wrote:
ihatethecorps wrote:Can anyone explain why Will Grigg is still at the club and how he still manages to steal a place on the bench? This bloke is awful with an even worse footballing brain.

One of our best chances today (not many too choose from) was when he picked up a loose ball at the edge of the box, and from an almost impossible angle decides hes going to shoot, not only that but its on his weaker right (left not much better) foot. All he had to do was hold the ball up, have a look round and see Macken was free 20yrds out.

Im sure he spends more time picking himself up off the ground after tripping himself up all the time. :evil:

P.s A missed opportunity to get 3 points today, but fair play to 'Pool, it was almost the perfect defensive away performance with Grof producing a good block from a rare attack to keep it at 0-0, 1 point is better than none.


What are you on about you moron???

Firstly he did well when he came on until he got an injury after colliding with the keeper.

Secondly, the chance was brought about by his pchasing and it was on his right foot from a very tight angle with nobody around him!! Sure you aren't on about bower man???

Maybe open your eyes next time you clown :roll:


Moron and clown, please stop praising me :D

Anyone who thinks Grigg is anything more than a pub player has surley got to be put down and put out of their misery. If you had opened your eyes, you would have seen Maken 20yrds out screaming for the ball, not saying he would have scored, but we'd have had an opportunity to create a far batter chance than from the angle grigg was shooting from.

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Re: Hartlepool United (H) League 1 Saturday 10/3/12.

Sat Mar 10, 2012 7:04 pm

ihatethecorps wrote:
Moron and clown, please stop praising me :D

Anyone who thinks Grigg is anything more than a pub player has surley got to be put down and put out of their misery. If you had opened your eyes, you would have seen Maken 20yrds out screaming for the ball, not saying he would have scored, but we'd have had an opportunity to create a far batter chance than from the angle grigg was shooting from.


Chatting absolute rubbish mate. Where were you watching from? I was side on and there was nobody near him. He hit a decent effort after being on for about 2 mins and the keeper kept it out. Macken was toddling through after this. Did you see Grigg pull in back on a plate for Mantom who was unfortunate with a bobble or were you looking to your left, I mean right, either way you wouldn't know as you seem to struggle with the idea.

Bowerman is supposed to be a first class finisher isn't he?? Shame he missed our 4-5 best chances today.

What was wrong with what Grigg did when he came on? He put himself about and went close a couple of times with half chances, then he got injured. Not much you can do with a dead leg or hammy inure and even then he played a few nice touches.

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Re: Hartlepool United (H) League 1 Saturday 10/3/12.

Sat Mar 10, 2012 7:12 pm

Well............got to go down as 2 points dropped!

This was anything but a classic encounter and brought back memories of some of the hoof-ball of years gone by of basement division footy.

Lets be fair.........Hartlepool came to the Bezza with a game plan to literally kick us off the park and play the long ball for 90 minutes in the hope they could muster a smash and grab raid of all 3 points. For those of us who have weathered the season so far, one thing is for sure with Butler, Lancashire/or Manny at the heart of the defence they aint got no chance.......and so it proved with only one momentary lapse in the 80th minute that saw Grof off his line quick to block with his legs - other than that our resident Hungarian stopper had nowt to do all game. Lancashire took a pounding in the first 15 minutes and seemed to go off with a bit of concussion, with Manny on who sorted their front line out for the rest of the game and took the sponsors MOM.......

Got to say our new arrivals have added some much needed steel to the middle of the park and we at last have some creativity and movement. That said, chances were few and far between at either end and despite our best efforts to raise the tempo we never tested their keeper apart from giving him catching practice with balls into the box that were easy pickings.

The last 10 minutes saw a couple of half chances blocked just inside the box and what looked like a stonewall penalty that the ref dismissed as our lad was left poll-axed by their keeper.......

Unfortunately we struggled to impose our style of play and resorted to playing long-ball tennis........ on the very rare ocassiion we got the ball on the deck we did look capable of carving out some chances, but they had done their homework and effectively took Cuvelier and our new look midfield out of the game by by-passing them with the long-ball and closing down the middle of the park so that there was little space.

Nil - Nil a fair result - had we imposed our game that worked so well on Tuesday we would have taken all 3 points for sure.

BRACKLEY

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Re: Hartlepool United (H) League 1 Saturday 10/3/12.

Sat Mar 10, 2012 7:17 pm

fatboyslim wrote:
ihatethecorps wrote:
Moron and clown, please stop praising me :D

Anyone who thinks Grigg is anything more than a pub player has surley got to be put down and put out of their misery. If you had opened your eyes, you would have seen Maken 20yrds out screaming for the ball, not saying he would have scored, but we'd have had an opportunity to create a far batter chance than from the angle grigg was shooting from.


Chatting absolute rubbish mate. Where were you watching from? I was side on and there was nobody near him. He hit a decent effort after being on for about 2 mins and the keeper kept it out. Macken was toddling through after this. Did you see Grigg pull in back on a plate for Mantom who was unfortunate with a bobble or were you looking to your left, I mean right, either way you wouldn't know as you seem to struggle with the idea.

Bowerman is supposed to be a first class finisher isn't he?? Shame he missed our 4-5 best chances today.

What was wrong with what Grigg did when he came on? He put himself about and went close a couple of times with half chances, then he got injured. Not much you can do with a dead leg or hammy inure and even then he played a few nice touches.


In fairness........I have often been first outa the blocks to lay criticism at Griggs door and for very good reason with him being totally ineffective on many ocassions. Today for the short time he was on the turf, he did ok - Bowerman aint ready, worthy of the bench, just lacks experience as you would expect.......the future looks bright mind you!

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Re: Hartlepool United (H) League 1 Saturday 10/3/12.

Sat Mar 10, 2012 7:18 pm

Saarland Saddler wrote:I am absolutely seething after that - crud hoof it channel football rubbish.

We had areal chance to take the game to Hartlepool today and give us some breathing space with 3 points.

Why do we insist on launching it down the channels?

It summed it up at the start of the first half for me. I thought we would come out and look to get the ball down and play (because we look good when we do). We passed the ball to Beevers who launched it down the line to their goalkeeper. Pathetic football.

Flo didn't get on the ball til the last ten minutes - partly because he was completely out of the game as the defence just launched it forward. The madness of it all is that all of our strikers are weak and can't win headers! SO WHAT IS THE POINT?!

Really rubbish performance today - just glad we got a draw. We are going to need a lot more guile and finishing if we are to play like that to stay up.

Need a striker, and we need to stop HOOFing it.

Oh dear....

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Re: Hartlepool United (H) League 1 Saturday 10/3/12.

Sat Mar 10, 2012 7:26 pm

Yep my bad Grigg is a fantastic player and goal scorer :roll:
Last edited by IHTC. on Sat Mar 10, 2012 7:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Hartlepool United (H) League 1 Saturday 10/3/12.

Sat Mar 10, 2012 7:26 pm

Was always going to be "After the Lord Mayors Show" and throw in a team with a tactic of "if it moves, kick it", then i think the result reflected the game.

Disappointed that Smith didn't throw on Jones when he brought Chambers on: a last throw of the dice, a rather more attacking move than the safety first approach by bringing Chambers on. However, we are creating chances now which two or three months ago we weren't.

As for Stuart Atwell, his legend lives on: how that wasn't a penalty on Macken i don't know and there should have been a yellow dished out to them long before he did-Monkhouse's leading with the arm to the back of Lancashire's head was cynical.

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Re: Hartlepool United (H) League 1 Saturday 10/3/12.

Sat Mar 10, 2012 7:38 pm

All that became was the Stuart Atwell show. It was a clear penalty and there should have been two yellows for fouls on Cuvelier alone, plus another for scything down Nicholls on the touchline. They came for a point, weren't bothered how they went about getting it and were aided and abetted by a weak ref. One of those days.

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Re: Hartlepool United (H) League 1 Saturday 10/3/12.

Sat Mar 10, 2012 7:43 pm

It was a match that we could and should have won but a performance to make people seethe ??? Really ???

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Re: Hartlepool United (H) League 1 Saturday 10/3/12.

Sat Mar 10, 2012 7:48 pm

Looking at the whole picture . we would have all taken 4 points from the last 2 games , we are 6 games unbeaten , 3 points clear of the drop zone , with a game in hand over the four clubs below us .

We are in with a fighting chance of avoiding the drop , every point is vital.

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Re: Hartlepool United (H) League 1 Saturday 10/3/12.

Sat Mar 10, 2012 7:52 pm

I think I was a bit harsh in hindsight.

One of my biggest bugbears in football is losing possession by channel hoofing - it absolutely does my head in.

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Re: Hartlepool United (H) League 1 Saturday 10/3/12.

Sat Mar 10, 2012 8:30 pm

Wow well i have to agree that it seems like two points dropped but cant see what grigg did wrong other than have a snap shot with little else on offer.

He also laid a fantastic pass to Mantom who rifled in a spectacular air shot from six yards out with the keeper to beat!! After tuesddays effort i think we can forgive him that one.

We actually created a fair few openings and with a little luck we would have been well clear in the second half.

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Re: Hartlepool United (H) League 1 Saturday 10/3/12.

Sat Mar 10, 2012 8:34 pm

Missed the last few games, including the 2 victories, so the last one I saw was Notts County at home when we were utter drivel. Even though today wasn't a great result, felt better about it. Flo is obvious class, Mantom and Hurst good on the ball and even Nicholls did OK. Disappointed that we did the hoofball thing in the first half because when we played a bit in the second half it was all much more positive. Bowerman looked like a boy lost at times, but his touch can be good and he gets into the right places, so hopefully it will come good. As we have said all season, a striker up with Macken is desperately needed.

Thought Grigg did OK when he came on.

Highlight had to be Jon Whitney squaring up to Neale Cooper. Given how cynically Pools played, Whitters should have chinned him.

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Re: Hartlepool United (H) League 1 Saturday 10/3/12.

Sat Mar 10, 2012 8:45 pm

Memo to Mr. Dean Smith:

Striker?
Yes we dow have money to spend, but surely there MUST be somone out there in the football arena desperate to play in first team & knock in a few goals, in a lower, or even higher, division?
Do we employ a scout? if so, what does he actually do? (can I have his job please?)

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Re: Hartlepool United (H) League 1 Saturday 10/3/12.

Sat Mar 10, 2012 9:00 pm

Saarland Saddler wrote:I think I was a bit harsh in hindsight.

One of my biggest bugbears in football is losing possession by channel hoofing - it absolutely does my head in.


The worst thing in my mind is repeated sideways going nowhere football, then second it would be aimless hoofball.

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Re: Hartlepool United (H) League 1 Saturday 10/3/12.

Sat Mar 10, 2012 9:01 pm

Ancient Moaner wrote:Memo to Mr. Dean Smith:

Striker?
Yes we dow have money to spend, but surely there MUST be somone out there in the football arena desperate to play in first team & knock in a few goals, in a lower, or even higher, division?
Do we employ a scout? if so, what does he actually do? (can I have his job please?)


If you look into it a bit, our "scouting network" is pathetic, and non existant.

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Re: Hartlepool United (H) League 1 Saturday 10/3/12.

Sat Mar 10, 2012 9:13 pm

latviancheese wrote:
Saarland Saddler wrote:I think I was a bit harsh in hindsight.

One of my biggest bugbears in football is losing possession by channel hoofing - it absolutely does my head in.


The worst thing in my mind is repeated sideways going nowhere football, then second it would be aimless hoofball.


....and that's why England are behind in football.

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Re: Hartlepool United (H) League 1 Saturday 10/3/12.

Sat Mar 10, 2012 9:19 pm

Can't really add much new information to what's already been posted. I came away with two thoughts uppermost in my mind - (a) Hartlepool are a more-than-physical side, and they had no compunction whatever in committing blatant fouls on anyone in with a chance of a sniff at goal. In this they were helped by (b) An extraordinarily weak referee, who seemed to think that every time a Walsall player was upended all he had to do was to have a quiet word with the Hartlepool player responsible and it would be all right. Sorry, but it doesn't work like that - if you let ultra-physical players get away with it they will take it as read that they can do it again. And they do (and did).

Certainly one of the two yellow cards he did show would have qualified as a red in many referees' judgments - when a player is en route to the goal with just the keeper to beat and is unceremoniously hacked down from behind I fail to see the excuse for a free kick and a yellow card. By awarding a free kick the referee has acknowledged that a foul took place, and by booking the player he shows that he thought it was a severe (worthy of a yellow card) foul. But for heaven's sake...chopping/barging/pushing/tripping the player in possession in that situation is surely a dismissable offence.

Having said all that, I have to agree to some extent with Saarland - we were our own worst enemy by lumping the ball forwards. In effect we were trying to play Hartlepool at their own game, and all you got was two sets of defenders winning headed clearances 95% of the time. Butler was immense in this department, ably assisted by Manny Smith. Every now and then Macken would get to a header first and flick it over his marker, but that's no good unless the ball is directed TO someone - all that happened was that another defender was there to hoof it away.

I was very much reminded of the home game against Rochdale - lots of head tennis. To be fair we did try a few passing moves, and when we did it looked quite good but it was too little and far too infrequent.

Macken was substituted (I guess) because his legs had given out. Lancashire did look dizzy after his clash of heads, and I hope there are no lasting ill-effects.

However.....if (a month ago) you'd have said to me that we would get to the middle of March 3 points clear of the relegation zone I would have been delighted, and I still am!! Onwards and upwards to Yeovil, who have (like us) discovered some very good form of late, and that's without Rene in goal or even on the bench - have they shipped him out? :?

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Re: Hartlepool United (H) League 1 Saturday 10/3/12.

Sat Mar 10, 2012 9:28 pm

Gilmartin was sent back to Watford by Johnson who brought his own keeper in when he took over about 8 or 9 games ago. Gilmartin's on loan at Crawley now.

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Re: Hartlepool United (H) League 1 Saturday 10/3/12.

Sat Mar 10, 2012 10:25 pm

Saarland Saddler wrote:
latviancheese wrote:
Saarland Saddler wrote:I think I was a bit harsh in hindsight.

One of my biggest bugbears in football is losing possession by channel hoofing - it absolutely does my head in.


The worst thing in my mind is repeated sideways going nowhere football, then second it would be aimless hoofball.


....and that's why England are behind in football.


You clearly mistake my point.

In my opinion, you keep possesion when you are winning. If its 0-0 what is a ball across the back four going to achieve, other than to bore fans to death. Its boring barclays football, its just as bad as hoofball. Because you are being a pussy and not going anywhere with it, these teams try to play possesion football, but are scared to use it properly.

Id rather watch a dog being bummed slowly by a squirell than your beloved Spanish football. German, English, Italian, its all more entertaining.

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Re: Hartlepool United (H) League 1 Saturday 10/3/12.

Sat Mar 10, 2012 10:26 pm

latviancheese wrote:
Saarland Saddler wrote:
latviancheese wrote:
Saarland Saddler wrote:I think I was a bit harsh in hindsight.

One of my biggest bugbears in football is losing possession by channel hoofing - it absolutely does my head in.


The worst thing in my mind is repeated sideways going nowhere football, then second it would be aimless hoofball.


....and that's why England are behind in football.


You clearly mistake my point.

In my opinion, you keep possesion when you are winning. If its 0-0 what is a ball across the back four going to achieve, other than to bore fans to death. Its boring barclays football, its just as bad as hoofball. Because you are being a pussy and not going anywhere with it, these teams try to play possesion football, but are scared to use it properly.

Id rather watch a dog being bummed slowly by a squirell than your beloved Spanish football. German, English, Italian, its all more entertaining.


The German (modern) and Italian games are much more similar to the Spanish game.

Have you forgotten which is the best league in the world? ...and also the european and world champions are?

Game, set and...

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Re: Hartlepool United (H) League 1 Saturday 10/3/12.

Sat Mar 10, 2012 10:30 pm

Welsh_Saddler wrote:Can't really add much new information to what's already been posted. I came away with two thoughts uppermost in my mind - (a) Hartlepool are a more-than-physical side, and they had no compunction whatever in committing blatant fouls on anyone in with a chance of a sniff at goal. In this they were helped by (b) An extraordinarily weak referee, who seemed to think that every time a Walsall player was upended all he had to do was to have a quiet word with the Hartlepool player responsible and it would be all right. Sorry, but it doesn't work like that - if you let ultra-physical players get away with it they will take it as read that they can do it again. And they do (and did).

Certainly one of the two yellow cards he did show would have qualified as a red in many referees' judgments - when a player is en route to the goal with just the keeper to beat and is unceremoniously hacked down from behind I fail to see the excuse for a free kick and a yellow card. By awarding a free kick the referee has acknowledged that a foul took place, and by booking the player he shows that he thought it was a severe (worthy of a yellow card) foul. But for heaven's sake...chopping/barging/pushing/tripping the player in possession in that situation is surely a dismissable offence.

Having said all that, I have to agree to some extent with Saarland - we were our own worst enemy by lumping the ball forwards. In effect we were trying to play Hartlepool at their own game, and all you got was two sets of defenders winning headed clearances 95% of the time. Butler was immense in this department, ably assisted by Manny Smith. Every now and then Macken would get to a header first and flick it over his marker, but that's no good unless the ball is directed TO someone - all that happened was that another defender was there to hoof it away.

I was very much reminded of the home game against Rochdale - lots of head tennis. To be fair we did try a few passing moves, and when we did it looked quite good but it was too little and far too infrequent.

Macken was substituted (I guess) because his legs had given out. Lancashire did look dizzy after his clash of heads, and I hope there are no lasting ill-effects.

However.....if (a month ago) you'd have said to me that we would get to the middle of March 3 points clear of the relegation zone I would have been delighted, and I still am!! Onwards and upwards to Yeovil, who have (like us) discovered some very good form of late, and that's without Rene in goal or even on the bench - have they shipped him out? :?


Let's hope our survival doesn't come down to this at the end of the season, but our massively better goal difference over all of the four teams below us is effectively an extra point in our favour, and if the defence continues to be as mean as of late, then that goal difference isn't likely to diminish much.

latviancheese
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Re: Hartlepool United (H) League 1 Saturday 10/3/12.

Sat Mar 10, 2012 10:36 pm

Saarland Saddler wrote:
Have you forgotten which is the best league in the world? ...and also the european and world champions are?

Game, set and...


If your going to tell me the Spanish league is the best in the world im going to roll around on the floor with laughter.

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Neuromantic
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Re: Hartlepool United (H) League 1 Saturday 10/3/12.

Sat Mar 10, 2012 10:37 pm

latviancheese wrote:
Saarland Saddler wrote:
Have you forgotten which is the best league in the world? ...and also the european and world champions are?

Game, set and...


If your going to tell me the Spanish league is the best in the world im going to roll around on the floor with laughter.


The Spanish league is the best in the world.

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