STANDING CONTINGENT APPEAL

[mrgoose]

PT, i think you get what I was getting at. The original post was a bit of a humorous challenge to engage comments. I knew we were going to get younger/less informed/intolerant individuals who would see the post a threat to doing what they want when the go to Walsall. I bet a lot of individuals are too young to have stood on the terrace at Bescot or Fellows Park.

[DonningtonSaddler]

I agree with this post. Why do people think they have the right to stand in front of other paying spectators. Do they stand up at the cinema too? Until they re-introduce standing areas be fair to others and sit down.

I went to the Shrewsbury match with my eight year old and got stuck behind two rows of lads who insisted on standing up. He couldn't see a blinking thing for most to of the match. I don't think I would have had much joy in getting the two rows in front of me to sit down if I'd asked them. We couldn't move as there were no other seats available.

ds,how do you compare a football match to the cinema ? thank god we do have some standers/singers or else it would be like the cinema :roll: theres always the oap stand

Well, I think it would be a jolly good idea to serve popcorn and have a lady with a tray of choc-ices standing behind the goal at half time. :roll: Good grief, does my comparison really need explaining???

yes. i dont see it

Go and buy a ticket for Les Mis and I'll come and stand in front of you. I will then admire your resolve as you move to another seat without a word of complaint. Wot? No standing areas in the cinema? Well, never mind those pesky rules were made to be broken.

[ws3]

Most people would accept that le mis is an event that you would sit through. Buy a ticket to see Black Sabbath and sit down and I bet you would miss the entire event. Watching football behind the goal is a standing event in my opinion so I would expect, in advance, that most people would be standing in that area.

[yoda]

Rules is Rules.

Is they really?

[boringteacher]

also , the way the 'poll' is worded is biased

Agreed. The debate should be about behind the goal, not generally. I've got a ST on the backrow, stand through the game but wouldn't routinely if I was going to block a view. Those 2 blocks are different.

[mrgoose]

ws3, your example highlights the issue, at Les Mis you would be with like minded people who all wish to sit again at Black Sabbath everybody would expect to stand, what we are saying is that is we are divided in what people at Walsall want.
At the moment the rules state everybody should sit, some people want to stand and do so, Walsall do not enforce the rule leading to problems like the one we have. Although at Black Sabbath if the security said everyone should sit and they did not the concert would stop. The same at Walsall if there were a great safety issue over non sitting the referee would have to stop the game.

[PeruSaddler]

Mr. Ravenscroft is being a bit naughty throwing in a comment about people standing up in front of him. He was in the upper TC stand and they obviously did so in a fit of excitement......

[DonningtonSaddler]

Most people would accept that le mis is an event that you would sit through. Buy a ticket to see Black Sabbath and sit down and I bet you would miss the entire event. Watching football behind the goal is a standing event in my opinion so I would expect, in advance, that most people would be standing in that area.

I agree. Stood up when I saw Sabbath at New Bingley Hall and the Birmingham Odeon in the early 80's and so did everyone else. The difference was that the vast majority of the audience were teenagers with greasy long hair and stank of patchouli. At football matches you get a whole cross section of society, the majority of whom prefer to sit down in an all-seater stadium. The ones who are in the wrong are those that stand and show no consideration for the people behind. For better or worse The Banks's is an all seater stadium and until it changes (and I would welcome fans be given the choice to stand behind the goal) people should sit.

[mrgoose]

DonningtonSaddler totally agree with your comments.

[King Crimson]

Christ, this is getting thoroughly depressing.

Instead of wanting the world to change to what it should be, why not just accept it for what it is and change what you do?

The speed limit on motorways is 70 mph. Some people go above it. Do you sit in the fast lane doing 70 with a sense of self-righteousness as the traffic builds up behind you, or move?

A right bunch of Richard Moneys

[We-ARE-Walsall]

Christ, this is getting thoroughly depressing.

Instead of wanting the world to change to what it should be, why not just accept it for what it is and change what you do?

The speed limit on motorways is 70 mph. Some people go above it. Do you sit in the fast lane doing 70 with a sense of self-righteousness as the traffic builds up behind you, or move?

A right bunch of Richard Moneys

:lol:

Not quite, it's a trait of his career that he does move when things don't go his way :lol:

[King Crimson]

Good point, well made, W-a-W.

[DonningtonSaddler]

Christ, this is getting thoroughly depressing.

Instead of wanting the world to change to what it should be, why not just accept it for what it is and change what you do?

The speed limit on motorways is 70 mph. Some people go above it. Do you sit in the fast lane doing 70 with a sense of self-righteousness as the traffic builds up behind you, or move?

A right bunch of Richard Moneys

I do a daily round trip of 140+ miles a day on the M6 to work. I stick to the speed limit as my livlihood depends on it. However, I do get aggrieved when vehicles tailgate me at 70mph in the middle lane when i'm overtaking traffic on the inside lane. I also get cheesed off when people pull out of the inside lane just as I am overtaking them (lorries mostly). I have learned the best place is to be is in the inside lane because I can dictate how much distance there is in front of me by adjusting my speed regardless of the inconsiderate and dangerous behaviours of others. I suppose there will always be inconsiderate tosspots impinging on your well being whether you are on the motorway or trying to watch your football team.

[King Crimson]

Christ, this is getting thoroughly depressing.

Instead of wanting the world to change to what it should be, why not just accept it for what it is and change what you do?

The speed limit on motorways is 70 mph. Some people go above it. Do you sit in the fast lane doing 70 with a sense of self-righteousness as the traffic builds up behind you, or move?

A right bunch of Richard Moneys

I suppose there will always be inconsiderate tosspots impinging on your well being whether you are on the motorway or trying to watch your football team.

Correct. So you take the appropriate action to mitigate their impact on you. I am suggesting the same logical approach should apply here.

There are other lanes on the M6. There are plenty of other seats at The Banks's.

The rights and wrongs of all this are somewhat ephemeral when it comes to a motorway journey or a match day. Sure, the police should stop every motorist who doesn’t recognise that 'rules are rules'. But they don't. Ditto our stewards. Either find strategies around it, or take A roads instead. Ditto The Banks's.

[Darth Vader]

Vicious circle that can only be solved by safe standing across the lower tier. Until that happens, enjoy boring squabbles about sitting down to please another's' needs, maybe they should stand up to please mine instead of telling everyone else what to do? If they aren't capable, they are in the complete wrong area of the stadium because at some point they'll be on their feet for a short period of time. The real strict sit down policy went out the window years ago anyway.

Brighton done it well with their new ground, said something like the back four rows of the North Stand you can stand freely no hassle, so be warned about wanting to actively sit that high up. Sorted.

[mrgoose]

Yes but driving over the speed limit is a choice that drivers take. It does not effect other drivers unless they cause an accident, which the police will then seek a prosecution for dangerous driving. The example should be that the people who are standing up are drivers driving at 40 mph in the fast lane and they should seek a different route more appropriate to their needs not imposing on how they want to use the motorway thus restricting other people.

[kpritchard05]

can't see why people are asking people to move who want to watch the match and we also clap and sing but you can do that from the comfort of your seat didn't relise you had to stand up to sing and clap and also why don't the few inconsiderate people who do want to stand up move to the end blocks will still get the same atmpsphere and will be able to stand up all match, why move the majority who sit instead of the minority who stand?

[DonningtonSaddler]

Christ, this is getting thoroughly depressing.

Instead of wanting the world to change to what it should be, why not just accept it for what it is and change what you do?

The speed limit on motorways is 70 mph. Some people go above it. Do you sit in the fast lane doing 70 with a sense of self-righteousness as the traffic builds up behind you, or move?

A right bunch of Richard Moneys

I suppose there will always be inconsiderate tosspots impinging on your well being whether you are on the motorway or trying to watch your football team.

Correct. So you take the appropriate action to mitigate their impact on you. I am suggesting the same logical approach should apply here.

There are other lanes on the M6. There are plenty of other seats at The Banks's.

The rights and wrongs of all this are somewhat ephemeral when it comes to a motorway journey or a match day. Sure, the police should stop every motorist who doesn’t recognise that 'rules are rules'. But they don't. Ditto our stewards. Either find strategies around it, or take A roads instead. Ditto The Banks's.

The point I was making is that I have changed my style of driving to mitigate the inconsiderate driving of others. I sit in the upper tier mainly to keep to dry but also to avoid the inconsiderate behaviour of stander uppers in the lower spanner. Until someone takes me out on the motorway due to their crud driving ability, or I have a dust up with some selfish git blocking my view I am happy to live with changes I have made to ensure my well being. However, if either of these scenarios occur I would expect the appropriate authorities to take action, be it the rozzers on the former or the stewards on the latter.

[Darth Vader]

I sit down on the toilet when I am curling one out, can't sit at the football, some people stand up in a pub all night at the bar, some chose to sit down.....what you as a person like to do.

Until something is sorted out to cater for all there is no answer.

[mrgoose]

Here's the folks at Rochdale policy to standing whilst visiting last Season.

http://www.photobox.co.uk/album/1748399389

[Fray Bentos is God!]

Luckily, Rochdale aren't in the same division anymore.

[Darth Vader]

Here's the folks at Rochdale policy to standing whilst visiting last Season.

http://www.photobox.co.uk/album/1748399389

Like I say, means nothing in most grounds nowadays, Notts Co are one who are still a pain but have still stood in the past. An irrelevant post if I ever saw one, there is a few 'bad language' signs about, I'm looking on creating a thread for all the people who swear to be banned for life. The Scunthorpe.

[kpritchard05]

Here's the folks at Rochdale policy to standing whilst visiting last Season.

http://www.photobox.co.uk/album/1748399389

Like I say, means nothing in most grounds nowadays, Notts Co are one who are still a pain but have still stood in the past. An irrelevant post if I ever saw one, there is a few 'bad language' signs about, I'm looking on creating a thread for all the people who swear to be banned for life. The lady gardens.

but your entering the ground so you accept the ground regulations and the ground regulations state that you can't stand in a seated area

[brummie saddler]

PT, i think you get what I was getting at. The original post was a bit of a humorous challenge to engage comments. I knew we were going to get younger/less informed/intolerant individuals who would see the post a threat to doing what they want when the go to Walsall. I bet a lot of individuals are too young to have stood on the terrace at Bescot or Fellows Park.

i think you badly wrong about the comment regarding your doubt over younger posters standing at Bescot, i would say 95% of people against your argument have stood at the Bescot.

young doesn't mean uneductated.

[We-ARE-Walsall]

Here's the folks at Rochdale policy to standing whilst visiting last Season.

http://www.photobox.co.uk/album/1748399389

Odd that I have stood the last two times I went there, all be it the one time wasn't for the whole game cos I sat down to have a sleep :lol:

[Fray Bentos is God!]

I have been to Spotland three times, stood, and never been arrested.

fudge the po-lice!

[IHTC.]

Why bring this up now? The seats have been there for 10/11 years or more and for most of the time people have stood in block 3 and 4 its not like its a new craze thats suddenly happened, yet year in year out you continue to still have the same seat knowing full well what's going to happen and you think a poll on here will change that. Yes people should not stand up but they/we do so more fool you for continuing to purchase the same seat knowing full well that your view will be obstructed. Sorry. If I ever felt the need to start sitting at every game or hopefully have a little one with me to take then I would just simply move to another block or area where our views are not restricted, simple really. And I agree that the wording of the poll is wrong and seems to have been put together by someone in Scotland :shock:

[chestersaddler]

The last time I had a problem was away at Southampton. There were a few older fans behind us who asked us to sit down. The problem was that had we sat down we would not have been able to see as everyone in front of us was standing. Jarod was 12 at the time so struggled to see much as it was.

I genuinely felt for them because they couldnt move, however, as PT stated earlier, these tend to be exceptions and you kind of know which matches they are likely to be.

I think that the singers should be applauded for trying to create an atmosphere. Somehow it ay the same singing when you are sitting down.

[King Crimson]

Yes but driving over the speed limit is a choice that drivers take.

So is standing up in an all-seater stadium.

It does not effect other drivers unless they cause an accident,

Nor does standin up unless the person behind can't see. Not quite sure where you're taking this.

which the police will then seek a prosecution for dangerous driving.

As could the club for breach of ground regulations. So?

The example should be that the people who are standing up are drivers driving at 40 mph in the fast lane

That's not against the law. Driving over 70 mph is. Hence the analogy.

and they should seek a different route more appropriate to their needs not imposing on how they want to use the motorway thus restricting other people.

What 'different route' is there for people who want to follow WFC and stand up?

As I said, and I don't quite think you're understanding me, it really doesn't matter whether they're right or wrong. Whether someone should be doing 90 mph down the fast lane or, in your example 40 mph, doesn't really matter. Taking your example though, you have a number of choices:
1) Sit behind them while they do 40 mph for the duration.
2) Overtake them on the inside - i.e. move to get around the irritation.
3) Flash your lights, beep your horn, get angry, and then do 1) or 2)
4) Do 1), 2), or 3) and then write a nasty letter to the Highways Agency/Police/The Pope complaining.
5) Avoid motorways as a bad thing, and maybe shut yourself away with The Jeremy Kyle Show and a wheelbarrow full of Tangy Cheese Doritos.

I don't see much difference at the match. Move, tell people to sit down who may or may not do what you ask, complain to the club, or don't go.

[mrgoose]

Ok King crimson lets put it simply. Do you stand up in the lower stand?