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Rochdale (H) League 1 Saturday 26/2/11.

Reports and reaction from the 2010-11 season as Walsall finished 20th in League 1
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latviancheese
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Re: Rochdale (H) League 1 Saturday 26/2/11.

Sat Feb 26, 2011 5:20 pm

Ive just got in and theres not much to say. Both teams were dire. We looked edgy, and they had clearly come for a point.

Anybody know whats up with Macken? Oh how we missed him today ,and Gill. Taundry is complete gash for 80 percent of the game.

The defence was solid enough, everything else was so poor. For both teams. Walker made a good save in the second half. First half we should have scored when the keeper dropped one, and Taundry also headed straight at him and should have scored.

Nicholls had a shocker even by his standards, Taundry was rather useless he always seems to never be where he should be. Richards also had a pretty poor game, but Taundry didnt help him. Grigg was dire, Price was rubbish although had a brief 5 minute spell where he did something and then Smith took him off... I thought the subs were strange today. Byfield might not be fit, but he should have come on before Paterson.

Macken and Byfield. Thats the only way we will stay up, oh and if this Argie can create something. It was back to horrible hoofball dross.

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bangsection
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Rochdale (H) League 1 Saturday 26/2/11.

Sat Feb 26, 2011 5:36 pm

It was important not to lose today because if we started with that XI for the rest of the season we would almost certainly get relegated.

Those who rubbish Macken's contribution were rewarded for their insight with an absolutely atrocious performance from Price today. Overweight, unfit, immobile and totally incapable of either winning the ball in the air or holding it up. If you haven't got a front man who can do that in this division you had better be a fabulous footballing side - which we aren't I'm afraid. Grigg wasn't much better and he blazed two of our best chances 30ft over the bar when well placed.

Byfield, Ledesma and Macken coming in offer some hope but what really worries me is if Richards or Butler get injured.

Disappointing because 'Dale were there for the taking today. Southampton will be a different proposition on Tuesday.

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Re: Rochdale (H) League 1 Saturday 26/2/11.

Sat Feb 26, 2011 5:37 pm

Agree with all that Latvian. I thought Rochdale showed a real lack of ambition first half, because when they tried to play a bit second half they looked like thy could move the ball rather well. I thought we were the better team first half, they were better second half, we had more chances, they came closest to scoring. All in all, a fair point, a clean sheet, but the goal drought continues.

I suppose we live to fight another day.

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Re: Rochdale (H) League 1 Saturday 26/2/11.

Sat Feb 26, 2011 5:59 pm

bangsection wrote:It was important not to lose today because if we started with that XI for the rest of the season we would almost certainly get relegated.

Those who rubbish Macken's contribution were rewarded for their insight with an absolutely atrocious performance from Price today. Overweight, unfit, immobile and totally incapable of either winning the ball in the air or holding it up. If you haven't got a front man who can do that in this division you had better be a fabulous footballing side - which we aren't I'm afraid. Grigg wasn't much better and he blazed two of our best chances 30ft over the bar when well placed.

Byfield, Ledesma and Macken coming in offer some hope but what really worries me is if Richards or Butler get injured.

Disappointing because 'Dale were there for the taking today. Southampton will be a different proposition on Tuesday.


Southampton will tear us apart.

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Re: Rochdale (H) League 1 Saturday 26/2/11.

Sat Feb 26, 2011 6:00 pm

latviancheese wrote:.................. oh and if this Argie can create something.



He's changed his mind.

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Re: Rochdale (H) League 1 Saturday 26/2/11.

Sat Feb 26, 2011 6:05 pm

I think some people are being a little harsh - or is that a sign of heightened expectations? It wasn't that bad a game. Certainly there have been many worse at Bescot over the last few years. A draw was probably a fair result. I can't believe how many people seem to think that we should see off the likes of Rochdale with ease. Have you seen their recent record?

I felt that we edged the first half with Price, Grigg and Taundry missing our three chances. For the first quarter of an hour of the second half, we were under the cosh. All of Rochdale's attacks came down their left, our right. I don't know whether they targeted Lescott because they felt he was simply a weak player or, more likely, he had less protection in front of him from Nicholls than, say, Williams did from Gray, on the opposite flank. However, we weathered the storm without really looking like scoring, ourselves. To be fair, Rochdale were just as ineffective in front of goal.

Walker - little to do but did it well - another clean sheet.

Lescott - despite being the target of Rochdale's early second-half flurry, he had a steady game.
Lancashire - growing steadily in confidence but can be muscled off the ball too easily at times.
Butler - played his usual captain's role - sponsors' MotM.
Williams - looked nervy at first but settled down well. Looks an asset. Didn't notice his missus anywhere!

Nicholls - runs about a lot with little end-product.
Taundry - same as Nicholls.
Richards - not one of his better games - poor with several mistakes which could have cost us.
Gray - frustrating - if anyone was going to be our match-winner, it was him. Unfortunately, the service to him was poor.

Price - dreadful - can't fault his effort but he offers no quality, whatsoever.
Grigg - a slightly more skilful version of Price. Never a threat.

Paterson - quick, with a good first touch but zero physical presence and in League One, that is quite a handicap.
Byfield - not on long enough to make an impact
Marshall - same as Byfield.

Bring on the Saints!

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Re: Rochdale (H) League 1 Saturday 26/2/11.

Sat Feb 26, 2011 6:29 pm

bangsection wrote:It was important not to lose today because if we started with that XI for the rest of the season we would almost certainly get relegated.

Those who rubbish Macken's contribution were rewarded for their insight with an absolutely atrocious performance from Price today. Overweight, unfit, immobile and totally incapable of either winning the ball in the air or holding it up. If you haven't got a front man who can do that in this division you had better be a fabulous footballing side - which we aren't I'm afraid. Grigg wasn't much better and he blazed two of our best chances 30ft over the bar when well placed.

Byfield, Ledesma and Macken coming in offer some hope but what really worries me is if Richards or Butler get injured.

Disappointing because 'Dale were there for the taking today. Southampton will be a different proposition on Tuesday.


Exactly, so today needed to be 3 points cuz dale were really there for the taking but we didn't have anything up top to worry then, I do think we will look back at this game if we go down and just wish the lads were just 5 % better today we could of picked up 3 big points, I havnt looked at other teams run ins but i would be surprised if teams have it harder, thats why its sooo important that we take 3 points when there for the taking

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Re: Rochdale (H) League 1 Saturday 26/2/11.

Sat Feb 26, 2011 6:30 pm

Back to pointless long ball rubbish. I imagine the idea was to feed Price with high balls to flick on. Unfortunately Price is one of those players that jumps 3 inches shorter than he stands in stockinged feet. Truely awful.

This is where Smith will prove his worth (or prove otherwise). The whole way we set out today was flawed and a re-think is needed soon.

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Re: Rochdale (H) League 1 Saturday 26/2/11.

Sat Feb 26, 2011 6:36 pm

Poor again today. For me that's 3 poor performances on the trot.

New manager syndrome has worn off now. we looked edgy & clueless up front today.

Unless the Argie & Byfield can work magic, I think we're down, when you look at who we've got left to play.

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Re: Rochdale (H) League 1 Saturday 26/2/11.

Sat Feb 26, 2011 6:42 pm

Pedagogue wrote:I think some people are being a little harsh - or is that a sign of heightened expectations? It wasn't that bad a game. Certainly there have been many worse at Bescot over the last few years. A draw was probably a fair result. I can't believe how many people seem to think that we should see off the likes of Rochdale with ease. Have you seen their recent record?
!


Come on, ive seen worse yes. But the game was enough to put anyone into a coma.

Rochdale obviously arent where they are on quality, they just work hard and grind it out. I dont expect us to see off Rochdale with ease, but they were no good today either. If we had turned up we should have won.

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Re: Rochdale (H) League 1 Saturday 26/2/11.

Sat Feb 26, 2011 6:54 pm

Pedagogue and Bangsection correct, everyone else wrong.

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Re: Rochdale (H) League 1 Saturday 26/2/11.

Sat Feb 26, 2011 7:09 pm

I was a bit dissapointed that we didn't go for it a bit more at the end. It seemed like we didn't want to win when Rochdale didn't look that good at all. Richards had a poor game by his standards, he still had some good moments but he gave the ball away a lot. Taundry puts himself about but doesn't look good enough. The defence looked solid again, we just need to hope that the Ledesma gives the team something extra and Byfield adds a bit more to our front line.

The Swindon game looks massive now.

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Rochdale (H) League 1 Saturday 26/2/11.

Sat Feb 26, 2011 7:21 pm

Cully wrote:Pedagogue and Bangsection correct, everyone else wrong.


I would agree with that. Apart from the bit about Pedagogue.

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Re: Rochdale (H) League 1 Saturday 26/2/11.

Sat Feb 26, 2011 7:26 pm

I hope the Argentinian lad can add a little spark to our forward play , too many long high balls for me most aimed at Price who couldn't jump to save his life he was awful .

Gray looked our best forward threat but wasn't used enough . on the plus side a clean sheet and a point against league 1's inform side .

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Re: Rochdale (H) League 1 Saturday 26/2/11.

Sat Feb 26, 2011 7:33 pm

A point is better than a defeat - and I'm pleased that another play-off chasing team has been seen off undefeated with comparative ease. They didn't stretch us other than the free header they spurned and a couple of smart saves from Walker.

That said, it was uninspiring from Walsall in the second half. No pace to the play, little movement off the ball, and too many long balls knocked towards a poor Price (who didn't quite deserve the idiocy of the home crowd booing him, ironically cheering him and barracking him off - we need to be behind the team, ineffective or not, because their heads need to be up. Disappointing, but not surprising, to hear that). Why we decided to abandon our fairly incisive and certainly superior style of on-the-deck passing in favour of hit-and-hopes from Walker and the full-backs was baffling, but forced upon us by a central midfield which rapidly dropped in influence after an impressive start and two full-backs too quick to go route-one. We did nothing to bring our wingers in to play in the second half, and I felt it was there that the absence of Gill was most keenly felt. Taundry didn't have that poor a game, but his presence stifles Richards (who was poor) and it shifts the balance of the side from one comfortable to keep in on the floor and play through the middle, which was served us so well recently, to a side lacking in ideas and content to look for the long ball too readily. It made for dull, uninspiring viewing.

We missed Macken dreadfully. Nothing stuck with the front two. I thought both Grigg and Price put a shift in, but they were dealt with easily by centre backs who I think would have struggled if Macken had have been there to draw them away from their flat-back four. Certainly on the one occasion their number 4 was caught out of position, Nicholls didn't exploit his lack of pace and the space it opened up.

I'd have brought Marshall into the middle earlier, since it was clear the team was bereft of creative ideas and in the few minutes he was on he did drift usually between the defence and midfield on a couple of occasions. Williams at left-back looked very tidy defensively but hardly got himself over the half-way line, which disappointed me.

All of that said, Rochdale are one of the form teams at the minute and those thinking they would be seen off easily were mistaken. They had come to maintain an unbeaten run and hope to catch us on the break, a plan they almost effected perfectly. We lack an incisiveness going forward and without Gill and Macken we were lacking the guile on the ball to bring our three most creative players (Nicholls, Gray and Richards) into play. Much to improve on, but a point and clean sheet; it does shift more pressure on to the Southampton game with result elsewhere today.

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Re: Rochdale (H) League 1 Saturday 26/2/11.

Sat Feb 26, 2011 7:35 pm

Happy with a point based on the performance, as we did not create anything all afternoon.

There is little doubt that the defence is much tighter under Smith and Williams looks a good addition. Butler shone once again. There number 11 stayed well away after a couple of cracking tackles in the first 20 minutes.

We missed Gill, I thought. He provided balance which neither Taundry or Marshall seem to be able to do. Nicholls was Nicholls and Gray was the new Gray in the first half but was quiet in the second.

We were completely punchless up front and I do not recall a single shot in the second half. We definately missed Macken.

The crowd were very quiet today (well our lot anyway), probably because we created so little. Let's hope the new bloke lives up to his billing and is able to create.

Overall, I left a little disappointed, not because we didn't win, but because we didn't ever look like winning.

Big test on Tuesday and then a massive game next Saturday.

Still confident

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Re: Rochdale (H) League 1 Saturday 26/2/11.

Sat Feb 26, 2011 7:48 pm

Sorry, but that was desperate stuff today. After watching the first 5 minutes of the second half, I was happy to settle for a point (even though it wasn't enough) because it could only have been an accident if we scored today. It's an indictment of dogface's squad that an injury to an overweight, past it striker meant that we had no-one who could even hold the ball up, let alone pose a threat to the opposition. If Macken is really our only threat, we are probably truly fudge.

However, results weren't too desperate today so they've still a shot at getting out of the cack. To do this, Macken and Byfield better stay fit, and Smith better learn quickly how to integrate our south american flair into a mediocre team. On the positive side, today was probably the first time this season when our defence didnt scare the cack out of me and you cannot therefore criticise Smith for playing Lescott instead of Darryl.

I hope ASPS is wrong and that the past couple of months ain't been new manager syndrome. His residual faith in that waste of cells occupying our right wingers shirt concerned me today however. While Griggs and Price were crap (and so bad I couldn't decide which was worse), to leave Nicholls on to the 87th minute was the sort of thing I'd have expected from the canine face.

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Re: Rochdale (H) League 1 Saturday 26/2/11.

Sat Feb 26, 2011 8:02 pm

I went today.

Agree pretty much with what has been said above, however I'd like to add:

- Why did we revert to 'pass it to the full back and lamp it down the channel' football a la Hutchings? Why?
- Zero pace up front.
- Complete joke of a midfield. I am sorry if this is unpopular but Richards was abysmal today. Taundry was even worse.
- Lescott is woeful and a liability.

(This is actually Bangor Cymru Saddler but at Percie's house)

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Re: Rochdale (H) League 1 Saturday 26/2/11.

Sat Feb 26, 2011 8:07 pm

Westlake is better than Lescott.

FACT

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Re: Rochdale (H) League 1 Saturday 26/2/11.

Sat Feb 26, 2011 8:15 pm

Yeah Richards was poor, he had a couple of decent moments but gave it away a lot. I'm not sure how much that was to do with being partnered with Taundry. I like Taundry a lot more than most people, he seems to give his all and is always the last person to leave the pitch when applauding fans but I just don't think he's good enough to keep us up. He has the passion and puts himself about but he was pretty poor again today.

I agree about Lescott as I think most would. I'd say that Williams is a better selection than Westlake. Even though he was far from perfect he still seemed to offer a bit more.

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Re: Rochdale (H) League 1 Saturday 26/2/11.

Sat Feb 26, 2011 8:17 pm

Two points slipped through our fingers but only a few months ago it would have been all three.

Price seemed on a mission to prove to the watching Liam Dickinson that it is possible to lead the Walsall line with even less impact than Dickinson did.

Taundry and Nicholls are physically fit lads but their football brains work in slow motion. It suites Taundry as his slow reaction turns a 75/25 into a 50/50 and he is so much more comfy battling for a 50/50 than he is when in possession. We're quite a patient lot in that we'll happily applaud the tackle that is Taundry's inevitable second touch.

Williams better than Westlake? Not on that showing.

The good stuff is that the two centre-halves are building a decent partnership and Walker is getting sharper and made a crucial save today. Grey played well again and when Byfield came on Grey got a shot in the arm as there was at last another person on the pitch in a red shirt who looked like he recognised the football as the thing he is paid to competently control and pass to a team-mate.

Two home clean sheets on the trot which is good and if we can get Macken, Byfield, Grey and new lad all fit and performing then we should score goals. I just have a horrible feeling that the two points we dropped today could haunt us. It won't be the reason we go down, that will lie squarely with the board, but it could be the cigarette paper that keeps us from the miracle.

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Rochdale (H) League 1 Saturday 26/2/11.

Sat Feb 26, 2011 8:31 pm

Not much I'd disagree with there, PT.

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Re: Rochdale (H) League 1 Saturday 26/2/11.

Sat Feb 26, 2011 8:40 pm

Ye Gods, that was dire fare. I came back for the first time since the new regime took over, and spent valuable time and good money watching a dismal match, devoid of skill, enterprise or entertainment. I was really hoping Dean would encourage a round of introductions in the dressing room at half time as our players looked to be strangers to each other on the pitch, but they were, in fact, even worse in the second half. There has been plenty of analysis of the game above, so I won't repeat at length what others have said - other than to say that it didn't stick up front, the wingers were barely used, midfield was poor, and only our defence looked OK.

As entertainment, it was awful. My alternative was B&Q with the family and by God I wished I'd joined them, and spent the money instead on a couple of CDs or a box set of Blake's Seven reruns (or frankly even some paint - I could have watched it dry). I'd been led to believe that we were playing entertaining football again, and that some atmosphere had returned to the home end. My belief was wrong on both counts - it was so quiet that when the bloke behind me asked me to sit down, the conversation was conducted in mime so that we didn't wake anyone up. Now, call me an old fart, but I was brought up on the football at FP in the 80s, when as I recall, we tended to see some decent attacking football and enjoyed ourselves more often than not. I fear that like my youth, the ability to run fast, and most of my hair, those days are long gone, never to return. 'Never to return' - yes, sounds a good idea at the moment...

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PT
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Re: Rochdale (H) League 1 Saturday 26/2/11.

Sat Feb 26, 2011 8:42 pm

King Crimson wrote:Not much I'd disagree with there, PT.


Think me and my lad followed you and yours up from the concourse at HT today. There was certainly the hint of a scouse accent, and in my lad's case more than a hint. Two scousers so close together? FBIG would have certainly deemed it a matter for the police (or pest control).

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Rochdale (H) League 1 Saturday 26/2/11.

Sat Feb 26, 2011 8:48 pm

PT wrote:
King Crimson wrote:Not much I'd disagree with there, PT.


Think me and my lad followed you and yours up from the concourse at HT today. There was certainly the hint of a scouse accent, and in my lad's case more than a hint. Two scousers so close together? FBIG would have certainly deemed it a matter for the police (or pest control).

You should have chanced your arm and said hello.

Even FBIG admits that when it comes to social niceties, I'm an absolute delight. :)

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Re: Rochdale (H) League 1 Saturday 26/2/11.

Sat Feb 26, 2011 9:09 pm

PT wrote:
King Crimson wrote:Not much I'd disagree with there, PT.


Think me and my lad followed you and yours up from the concourse at HT today. There was certainly the hint of a scouse accent, and in my lad's case more than a hint. Two scousers so close together? FBIG would have certainly deemed it a matter for the police (or pest control).


I thought i was hearing things.... :? :lol:

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Re: Rochdale (H) League 1 Saturday 26/2/11.

Sat Feb 26, 2011 9:57 pm

I hope we ay starting down the road of returning to long hoof ball rubbish. I thought Dean was much better than that.

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Re: Rochdale (H) League 1 Saturday 26/2/11.

Sat Feb 26, 2011 10:01 pm

One point won or two points dropped,not really sure,only time will tell. On a positive note at the back we looked solid throughout the game,Walker having a steady game as we have become used to,also think that the centre half partnership is working well at the moment with the impressive Butler winning most of his challenges both in the air and on the ground and bringing the best out of Lancashire who is the partner best suited to play alongside the skipper. Thought both full backs did okay, Williams looked solid when defending and did try to link up with Gray going forward, particularly first half, hopeful that with games under his belt there could be more to come. As I have been saying for a few weeks Westlake will become a good player but felt the time is right for him to be taken out of the firing line, Lescott did okay even though they obviously worked out his weakness in the air and gave him plenty to think about second half.

The lack of quality in the squad was there to see today particularly as an attacking force, our midfield did not control any part of the game and without Macken up front the long hopeful balls were always easy for their centre halves to deal with. Julian Gray looked a class act first half but our lack of quality resulted in him feeding on scraps second half with nobody seeming capable of passing the ball simple and to feet.

Moving forward lets hope that Ledesma can bring some flair to the team, Macken gets himself fit as we really missed him today, Byfield finds some goals on his return and we can sign that elusive midfield player that can add some quality to the team as well as helping Richards back to playing like we know he can. Not going to name individuals, however, if we have to play many of the remaining games with some of todays starting eleven safety will be a long way away.

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Re: Rochdale (H) League 1 Saturday 26/2/11.

Sat Feb 26, 2011 10:33 pm

Today was a typical boring 0-0 draw where both teams didn't really mind taking a point from the game which in our case is a little worrying considering we need all the 3 points we can get.
I think at the back we are quite comfortably to be honest, Butler and Lancashire seem to be building a great partnership together. I thought Williams looked very steady once he got into the game abit. Lescott isn't great but i don't think it will be long before he's dropped and Westlake comes back in.
The midfield would worry me a little if it wasn't for the fact that i know Ledesma has signed because The likes of Nicholls,Taundry and Marshall seem to be battling midfield players rather than midfielders with a bit of quality but i did think Taundry was one of few today that had a DECENT game.
Now, upfront is one were i really get very worried. Price is cack, to rely on either Grigg or Paterson at this stage is a little too much, Byfield will get a little knock in training on monday im sure. Macken is probably our only little slice of a danger in and around the box but im still rather unsure about him.

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Re: Rochdale (H) League 1 Saturday 26/2/11.

Sun Feb 27, 2011 12:14 am

tinned wrote:I hope we ay starting down the road of returning to long hoof ball rubbish. I thought Dean was much better than that.


No point going through midfield if Taundrys playing, the bloke cant pass to save his life.

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