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Oldham Athletic (H) League 1 Saturday 25/1/11 Re Arranged

Reports and reaction from the 2010-11 season as Walsall finished 20th in League 1
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Pedro
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Oldham Athletic (H) League 1 Saturday 25/1/11 Re Arranged

Wed Jan 26, 2011 9:34 am

Thought the lads did great last night and was really pd off we did not steal that victory.

We need the goal poacher, I'd make a cheeky offer to Kevin Phillips. He's been told he can leave Blues and he has a young family so may want to stay local.

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Re: Oldham Athletic (H) League 1 Saturday 25/1/11 Re Arranged

Wed Jan 26, 2011 9:36 am

Cheesebag wrote:In fact, as Ive said before...with a Deeney in the team, and the chances we are now creating in the last 5 games we could of had 6 or 7 points more.

Definitely.

I said after the game last night that I think we just have to look to score one more than the opposition in each game now. Building a team from the back should always be a manager's priority, but Smith doesn't have the time to bring in a new back four and gel them together. The damage has been done by Hutchings' poor signings.

We need a striker and I think the sort we need is a target man. Grigg is clever enough to be able to link-up with Macken, so shouldn't have a problem linking up with someone who offers a bit more strength in the final third. Macken has done ok of late, but he carries next to no genuine goal threat, which is a worry given the position we're in.

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Re: Oldham Athletic (H) League 1 Saturday 25/1/11 Re Arranged

Wed Jan 26, 2011 10:39 am

Isn't it fascinating how we all see the same game so differently?!!

I agree with quite a few others who say it was a decent performance last night. Some good football being played and some passion being shown. What we clearly are, though, is a lightweight powder-puff team. Lescott, too easily brushed aside. Lancashire, not physical enough yet. Nicholls, pathetically lightweight. Richards, scared of a tackle (and that's from someone who thinks he's as good a player as we've got right now!). Gray, lightweight. Grigg, a boy asked to do a man's job.

The difference with Oldham, whether or not you think the ref should have called certain fouls, is that they were prepared to get physical, wrestle player, push players off the ball etc.

As for attacking, we had some real success early on playing the ball on the deck and working through the middle where Grigg, and even Macken, had the beating of the centre halves for pace. The movement early on from the front two was superb, giving options for the man in possession. Some of Macke's touches were sublime, he opened up the game so many times, plus he put in a good working shift.

However, as the game went on, Grigg tired (from about the hour) and should have been replaced. He was lightweight and anonymous from then on. Perhaps to be expected from a young lad, and a further indication in my opinion that scrapping the reserve team was one of the worst decisions ever taken at this club. By contrast, Macken seemed to still have energy but his attitude lets him down. Frustrated by the ref not calling fouls on him, he firstly gets wrapped up in vendettas against opposition players (that was a nasty challenge on their centre half) and then lets that distract him from the game.

I'm afraid the wingers provide nothing of any value. With Westlake playing so well when attacking, and being able to defend to some extent, I wonder whether we could move him forward into right midfield at some point.

At the back, I thought Lancashire was a massive improvement on Smith and McDonald, but he lacks presence and did make one huge error that could have cost a goal. That said, he also made a couple of trememndous last ditch blocks/tackles and his value is in the fact he can play football and is comfortable on the ball.

Do I think we can avoid relegation? Probably not, but who knows if we can get 2 or 3 players in to make a difference, and start with a win on Saturday. We need full-back cover, a wide man and a striker to play off Macken at the very least.

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Re: Oldham Athletic (H) League 1 Saturday 25/1/11 Re Arranged

Wed Jan 26, 2011 10:58 am

its amazing reading fans own write ups so black and white its untrue
great reading though

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Re: Oldham Athletic (H) League 1 Saturday 25/1/11 Re Arranged

Wed Jan 26, 2011 11:17 am

Players not replaced but would still get in the team. Ian Roper, Dwane Mathis, Hughes, Vincent,Ince and not ever my favourites, Gillmatin and Troy Deeney( good price tho).

We have had to resort to playing two old men and/or rookies in key positions, keeper and striker. The positions we looked strong in with Smith and Macdonald have also become a major concern .

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Re: Oldham Athletic (H) League 1 Saturday 25/1/11 Re Arranged

Wed Jan 26, 2011 11:31 am

portlandbill wrote:Players not replaced but would still get in the team. Ian Roper, Dwane Mathis, Hughes, Vincent,Ince and not ever my favourites, Gillmatin and Troy Deeney( good price tho).

We have had to resort to playing two old men and/or rookies in key positions, keeper and striker. The positions we looked strong in with Smith and Macdonald have also become a major concern .


Add Gerrard, Junior, Jorge...

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Re: Oldham Athletic (H) League 1 Saturday 25/1/11 Re Arranged

Wed Jan 26, 2011 11:58 am

Its also clear to me although the midfield was improved, its still barely fixed. Last night they rarely supported the attack, and neither did they get back to defend quick enough. It all went sideways, which is fine if you have two decent enough wingers.

Its still powderpuff. Gill is energetic, but he's average all round egg. We need a battler, especially down the bottom.

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Re: Oldham Athletic (H) League 1 Saturday 25/1/11 Re Arranged

Wed Jan 26, 2011 12:07 pm

after reading different opinions of the game can anyone suggest which is the most honest and nearest to the match as can be.
or which poster in your opinion writes the best post, true to the game

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Re: Oldham Athletic (H) League 1 Saturday 25/1/11 Re Arranged

Wed Jan 26, 2011 12:11 pm

morethanuknow wrote:after reading different opinions of the game can anyone suggest which is the most honest and nearest to the match as can be.
or which poster in your opinion writes the best post, true to the game

I think the idea is, you read the various reports available and get an idea from the combination.

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Re: Oldham Athletic (H) League 1 Saturday 25/1/11 Re Arranged

Wed Jan 26, 2011 12:15 pm

the midfield are probably under new instructions since the arrrival of nicholl
if you listen to ds he says in his interview he said we had 2 solid lines of 4. which probaly means he doesnt want the centre mids to push on but with that becomes less chances to score
so hes sacrifising the attacking probably for a more defensive attitude .maybe this could have something to do with the reason why we are now scoring less in his games in charge
and everyone now wants a striker ???????????

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Re: Oldham Athletic (H) League 1 Saturday 25/1/11 Re Arranged

Wed Jan 26, 2011 12:18 pm

its impossible as the opinions of the game are so black and white i cant get an idea
maybe some fans smoke too much weed maybe some have a little too many so id just like the fans opinions on who writes the best one
please

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Re: Oldham Athletic (H) League 1 Saturday 25/1/11 Re Arranged

Wed Jan 26, 2011 12:23 pm

its impossible as the opinions of the game are so black and white i cant get an idea
maybe some fans smoke too much weed maybe some have a little too many so id just like the fans opinions on who writes the best one
please


Surley that depends on who's views match you own?

for example, loads of talk on how well westlake played last night, where as I thought he was at fault for the first goal and defensivly was very poor and would of been slated by all if it wasn't for his goal. Also thought Butler was Imence where as a few people have said he had a poor game. All about opinions

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Re: Oldham Athletic (H) League 1 Saturday 25/1/11 Re Arranged

Wed Jan 26, 2011 12:25 pm

this is what i mean on sddlers player they werent that impressed with westlake and said butler had one of his worst games

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Re: Oldham Athletic (H) League 1 Saturday 25/1/11 Re Arranged

Wed Jan 26, 2011 12:49 pm

I'd say Westlake had a few dodgy moments defensively, but then he was up against Oldham's best player by a mile. As for Butler, he was dreadful in possession at times, but immense in winning the ball at others. He's certainly good enough for this division, and there were at least signs that he and Lancashire can compliment each other. With Smith and Butler together, you've got no ability on the ball at all.

I think the comments about the weakness of midfield are correct. Gill I suspect lacks match practice and hopefully can offer more in the coming weeks. Richards offers himself for the pass constantly, passes and moves, plays some nice football and makes some great runs forward....but for all that, he can't tackle and is scared of the rough stuff. Not much good for a midfielder, unless the rest of your midfield are prepared to do the battling for him....unfortunately we have Gray and Nicholls! :roll:

As for getting a striker, Grigg is raw and unproven. I'm surprised so many people criticise Macken after last night. He's certainly the best option we've got for 60-65 minutes. His touch is exceptional at times and his flicks and passes can open up the game in an instant. What we lack is someone with the brains and sharpness to capitalise. Byfield could be that person if ever he comes back.

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Re: Oldham Athletic (H) League 1 Saturday 25/1/11 Re Arranged

Wed Jan 26, 2011 2:25 pm

Most people go to a match and watch the overall pattern, who attacks the most and how many shots on goal and how exciting it is. You come away remembering great moments, shots on goal, great saves headers won etc. You also favour or spot the mistakes of the players who are close to you. The average fan does not watch the basics, covering, tracking back reading the situations,basic passes , headers etc. That is why some people say X had a bad game whilst others appreciate the good but unspectacular things he had done. That is why reports differ,and man of the match can go to a player who did very little overall but lashed in a great 30 yarder.

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Re: Oldham Athletic (H) League 1 Saturday 25/1/11 Re Arranged

Wed Jan 26, 2011 6:35 pm

Just watched the highlights on saddlers player to remind me of the game last night. Some positive attacking play despite only 1 goal but some very dodge defending yet again at times. Gill lost the ball trying a trick in the centre circle which allowed Taylor to nearly score, there was some fanning about in the box for the morais goal and both westy and lancashire nearly gave away goals with silly mistakes.

Great strike from westy for the goal.

Those on Will Grigg's back for lacking pace should watch the highlights, to me he seems to be comfortably keeping ahead of the last defender for his beat chance which ended with a good save from the keeper with his legs.....had he lifted the ball slightly and it gone in I am sure the reports would have been a lot more positive. He just miss touched for the first chance when he was trying to take it past the keeper and the 2nd chance he was stretching for the ball and didn't get enough on it.

He did a nice touch in the first minute to put nichols through for a chance. Granted he tired towards the end but at least he is getting in the right positions. Only had 4 full games in his pro career and league 1 footy is a huge step up from reserves so he will still be building up to full fitness. The physical aspect is something over looked as can really sap the energy when up against strong defenders. Something else he will be getting used to.



Highlights are good as not always the best view from certain areas of the ground.

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Re: Oldham Athletic (H) League 1 Saturday 25/1/11 Re Arranged

Wed Jan 26, 2011 7:35 pm

just watched the hihlights
im sorry and i dont want to call the young grigg but he was poor i know there was other poor players on the pitch but he as to do better than that for a centre forward

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Re: Oldham Athletic (H) League 1 Saturday 25/1/11 Re Arranged

Wed Jan 26, 2011 8:46 pm

[b]Please give Grigg a chance. Only about 4 full games in the first team, almost no reserve team football this season, to me he looks to have potential.
I remember Walsall fans saying Rickets couldn't play when he broke into the team.

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Re: Oldham Athletic (H) League 1 Saturday 25/1/11 Re Arranged

Wed Jan 26, 2011 9:45 pm

morethanuknow wrote:just watched the hihlights
im sorry and i dont want to call the young grigg but he was poor i know there was other poor players on the pitch but he as to do better than that for a centre forward

Out of interest, did you go to the game last night? Don't want to have the same old 'if you didn't go, you can't comment argument' because you're free to say what you like. All I would say is that the highlights don't show how well he did with his back to goal at times, despite being marked by two absolute brutes.

Your comment has raised another more topical point though. This seven sub rule hasn't half stifled the development of some players, has it? With five subs on a matchday, the likes of Westlake, Paterson & Grigg would have been loaned out to Blue Square Premier clubs at some stage, giving them that vital first experience of playing for someone else, playing out of their comfort zone and learning the game. Instead, they come straight from the youth team, into our squad and look as raw as can be at times.

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Re: Oldham Athletic (H) League 1 Saturday 25/1/11 Re Arranged

Wed Jan 26, 2011 9:58 pm

moanin old git wrote:the list of our Ex players playing thier socks off currently is endless

We only notice their name when they score, we don't hear about all of the times they play poorly. How many players have we released who are playing in league one or above?

I'm sorry but Grigg will never make it for us and disappear off the radar.

He's 19, started five matches, and is playing in a struggling team. I think it's too early to make that judgement. Out of interest MOG, how many of his five starts have you seen?

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Re: Oldham Athletic (H) League 1 Saturday 25/1/11 Re Arranged

Thu Jan 27, 2011 12:00 am

i have said i watched the highlights and that means they are suppost to be the best parts to watch.
we will go down if grigg plays like what the highlights show he is the focal point of the team everybody is aiming to get him in on goal and watching the highlights he just isnt googd enough at the moment .some say hes only played so many games but that also applies to lancashire,marshall,players who are also inexperienced but its ok for fans on here to murder these kids who havent played as many games as grigg.is it because they arent our own im not sure but it would be nice if fans were fair with all the young ones
and not just one or 2
i know what i seen on the highlights and i will stick to what im saying he just isnt good enough at the moment to lead the line.this is my opinion and im sorry if no one agrees but there you go

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Re: Oldham Athletic (H) League 1 Saturday 25/1/11 Re Arranged

Thu Jan 27, 2011 7:24 am

morethanuknow wrote:i have said i watched the highlights and that means they are suppost to be the best parts to watch.
we will go down if grigg plays like what the highlights show he is the focal point of the team everybody is aiming to get him in on goal and watching the highlights he just isnt googd enough at the moment .some say hes only played so many games but that also applies to lancashire,marshall,players who are also inexperienced but its ok for fans on here to murder these kids who havent played as many games as grigg.is it because they arent our own im not sure but it would be nice if fans were fair with all the young ones
and not just one or 2
i know what i seen on the highlights and i will stick to what im saying he just isnt good enough at the moment to lead the line.this is my opinion and im sorry if no one agrees but there you go


Obviously entitled to your own opinion.but if you are going to have one then at least get the fact right. Go on the OS and look at the player profiles, then come back and tell me lancashire and Marshall haven't played as many games as grigg. Ludicrous comment. They are both older and have made more han twice as many starts as grigg already this season before you even begin on their previous experience at other clubs. Other than his 5 starts grigg has been brought on as a sub which is a different kettle of fish.
Pretty sure you were saying he should start the other day so perhaps you should have a bit more faith than judging a young player on one game and then backing up your criticism with made up facts.
All players have off games. If he scores on Sat then opinions will be reversed again. That's the world of football i suppose. If grigg hadn't provided 3 assists in the prior 3 games then we would have even less goals than we do now.......macken doesn't score many at all, i hav3 seen plenty of chances this season go begging from him and as i have said before also from nicolls, Reid and any of the other strikers we have had in the team.

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Re: Oldham Athletic (H) League 1 Saturday 25/1/11 Re Arranged

Thu Jan 27, 2011 7:54 am

my point is he is there to score. for instance if matty richards slips grigg in 3 times in a game and nothing comes of it like the highlights then we need a striker full stop
if grigg scores 2 of the chances then hes an excellent striker no matter what else went on in the game and it would also make whoever slipped him in look very good as wel
but because it amounting to nothing then richards wouldnt look as good and neither does grigg and we dont win .i honestly cant see your point about grigg.in my opinion he isnt ready
im not saying he will never be ready but there is a saying in football yore as good as your last game.i dont understand why bonser as given ds the job because it doesnt look like he is backing him moneywise .i know if i watched that game i would get a forward straight away

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Re: Oldham Athletic (H) League 1 Saturday 25/1/11 Re Arranged

Thu Jan 27, 2011 8:03 am

seeing as you want to pull may argument apart like so many on here do to each other
i was replying to someone saying griig hasnt started many consecutive games but im sure neither have the likes of lancashire ,marshall ,patterson etc who are expected to come into
the team after sitting it out for 2 months and then play 3 games in a week and deliver the goods.maybe grigg is knackered i dont know im going off what i have seen

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Re: Oldham Athletic (H) League 1 Saturday 25/1/11 Re Arranged

Thu Jan 27, 2011 8:06 am

i dont want to get into the hes better than him debate
you say grigg and i say no thats it
stats show mackern as played 21 games 3 as sub 4 goals
grigg as played 15 times 10 as sub 1 goal

this for me makes us very poor upfront

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Re: Oldham Athletic (H) League 1 Saturday 25/1/11 Re Arranged

Thu Jan 27, 2011 8:49 am

morethanuknow wrote:i dont want to get into the hes better than him debate
you say grigg and i say no thats it
stats show mackern as played 21 games 3 as sub 4 goals
grigg as played 15 times 10 as sub 1 goal

this for me makes us very poor upfront


Yes it is poor but with a teenage striker, you need to look at the bigger picture. Goals rarely flow for kids, especially in rubbish teams like us, but you have to look at the fact that he shows real glimpses of ability and actually gets into the right postions/uses his brain at times. None of our other strikers do that so surely he should be the first striker on the team sheet as we've hardly got anyone to come in have we? The rest of this season is about building for Division 2 - lets not kid ourselves. If that means starting Grigg to get him more experience then so be it. His stats above are comparable with Fryatt's first season with us... 1 in 12 for us and 1 in 10 on loan for Carlisle. He may not be great, but he is a lot better than anything else at the moment.

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Re: Oldham Athletic (H) League 1 Saturday 25/1/11 Re Arranged

Thu Jan 27, 2011 8:53 am

morethanuknow wrote:i dont want to get into the hes better than him debate
you say grigg and i say no thats it
stats show mackern as played 21 games 3 as sub 4 goals
grigg as played 15 times 10 as sub 1 goal

this for me makes us very poor upfront


Fair enough mate, I suppose everyone looks at things differently.

Debating aside, we need to win on Saturday and hopefully we will! Time is running out for the new players that have been suggested to be brought in this week - think they need more than a days training to be able to rock up on Saturday and play. We shall see!

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Re: Oldham Athletic (H) League 1 Saturday 25/1/11 Re Arranged

Thu Jan 27, 2011 9:07 am

100% agree we need a win
god knows why we havent brought in any players though,maybe we are getting ready for league 2 who knows . bonser as no ambition whatsoever imo for walsall anymore its as if the fight as gone out of his belly but the players and manager are giving it everything

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Re: Oldham Athletic (H) League 1 Saturday 25/1/11 Re Arranged

Thu Jan 27, 2011 9:14 am

Really looking forward to Saturday it will be the start of the Great Escape, remember WBA in the Prem!

Just a couple of other comments, Deano looked to me to set out Gill in front of the back four with Richards generally in front of him but it is 100% spot on to state we are lacking in a physical presence which is why Butler stands out so much.

I think Westlake would do a great job in RM as I think he is composed and has a better defensive capability than Fox but opinions eh.

Looking at the comments from Deano we have been knocked back on a few players, it is key we keep the balance of the squad as we have started progressing so this week is key. Looks like Byfield is weeks away, so up front is weak, you could argue we need strengthening all over but too late for that.

Who is actually available as I am finding it difficult to thnk of anyone, maybe Vokes, Osbourne, who is at Everton? as the last three were ok :D Davis looks like he is coming back? plus Wackers last game is Saturday so he needs a contract till the ned of the season

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Re: Oldham Athletic (H) League 1 Saturday 25/1/11 Re Arranged

Thu Jan 27, 2011 9:30 am

Mal wrote:Really looking forward to Saturday it will be the start of the Great Escape, remember WBA in the Prem!

Just a couple of other comments, Deano looked to me to set out Gill in front of the back four with Richards generally in front of him but it is 100% spot on to state we are lacking in a physical presence which is why Butler stands out so much.

I think Westlake would do a great job in RM as I think he is composed and has a better defensive capability than Fox but opinions eh.

Looking at the comments from Deano we have been knocked back on a few players, it is key we keep the balance of the squad as we have started progressing so this week is key. Looks like Byfield is weeks away, so up front is weak, you could argue we need strengthening all over but too late for that.

Who is actually available as I am finding it difficult to thnk of anyone, maybe Vokes, Osbourne, who is at Everton? as the last three were ok :D Davis looks like he is coming back? plus Wackers last game is Saturday so he needs a contract till the ned of the season


Vokes would be good, Davis was useless in my opinion and added nothing, Wacka will be here until the end of the season on my opinion. Do you mean Isiah Osbourne? If so then no chance as he has already played games in the Championship on loan. We only have the hope of getting someone old like Macken, someone young and unproven like grigg or someone not good enough for the championship like gill. Fingers crossed they can help us though!

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