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Hull (a) - League - 11th November 2004

Reports and reaction from the 2004-05 season as Walsall finished 14th in League 1
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Hull (a) - League - 11th November 2004

Mon Dec 06, 2004 6:09 pm

By wfc_2uk (213.48.83.107) on Wednesday, November 03, 2004 - 11:16 pm:

Got my ticket today three mates are going away with me for the first time this season. Bring a mate along lets fill the stand and lets shout the lads to their first 3 away points of the season.I have a good feeling. 2-0.

By Andrew Curl (82.37.160.129) on Wednesday, November 03, 2004 - 11:30 pm:

I hope you're right.

By SheffieldSaddler (172.190.198.106) on Wednesday, November 03, 2004 - 11:58 pm:

wfc - If we beat Hull City 2-0, I will buy you a bottle of you favourite spirit to the value of £30.

By Fensaddler (82.37.172.192) on Thursday, November 04, 2004 - 12:03 am:

I hope he's right, but I'm not buying anybody anything, and I'm not making any predictions.

By SheffieldSaddler (172.190.198.106) on Thursday, November 04, 2004 - 12:27 am:

I wonder why that is?

By Exile (203.167.253.205) on Thursday, November 04, 2004 - 12:50 am:

Everyone - start praying for a 2-0 victory

By RedAlways (195.92.168.179) on Friday, November 05, 2004 - 12:23 am:

Don't know about a 2 0 win, but I get the feeling that we are getting much harder to beat.

The next step, assuming at least a draw on Saturday, is to start dominating midfield. If Osborn, Kinsella, Standing and Wrack can all hit reasonable form together that is a possibility. It might then be possible to use Merson as a sub to change things around if necessary.

Perhaps we expected too much too quickly. With a few changes in the next close season and another years experience for the kids, we might be in much better shape to have a go at what should still be called the second division.

By Neil Ravenscroft (82.37.185.68) on Friday, November 05, 2004 - 08:24 am:

A few changes next season?
You mean find replacements for Merson (do you think he could play another full season?), Osborn (do you think he'll get another playing contract - look at his age?), Emblen (ditto), Kinsella's contract will be up, Aranalde's, I believe, Bazeley will be gone and that's just for starters. I think it's unlikely we'll have Fryatt and Bennett, as someone will have made Bonser an offer he can't refuse, so I think you'll find it would be major changes.
Kris Taylor, Standing and Broad's contracts are all up as well, aren't they?

By TJ Langford (213.18.248.23) on Friday, November 05, 2004 - 11:52 am:

yeah good lets make some noise and put hull to shame i think if we give loads of support to the lads we can scrape a 1-0 win

By mikedoyle (81.130.23.193) on Friday, November 05, 2004 - 12:05 pm:

Bloomin `eck Neil ageist or what!

Baze 32 Zigor 31 Osborn 32,all should have at least another season in them,even Merson and Eblen at 37 and 34,should be looking comfortable at this level,which I admit would appear to be the level we will be playing at next year.

yes we need to mix in the younger lads, not all of whom will depart despite your prophecy of doom,and a few additions would be useful,but that is the norm in the close season anyhow.

By JohnSpenton (195.93.34.9) on Friday, November 05, 2004 - 12:13 pm:

Where can I park in Hull?




By Neil Ravenscroft (62.172.127.2) on Friday, November 05, 2004 - 12:16 pm:

Check out the "Dave Roe" thread lots of details.

Mike Doyle, that was a reaction to Redordead saying we'd be alright next season with "just a few changes". I think there'll be wholesale ones. As for Bennett and Fryatt, offer Bonser in the region of 200,000 and he'd snatch hands off.

By WarsawPact (217.205.45.94) on Friday, November 05, 2004 - 12:55 pm:

Nice to know we make such a good impression on people...

http://boards.footym ad.net/mboard/load.p hp?tno=297&fid=148&s ty=2&act=1&mid=21430 80703

By Chrome Dome (194.72.37.252) on Friday, November 05, 2004 - 01:17 pm:

Hull - unemployed trawlermen, riots at rugby league matches, John Prescott, its very own telephone company, The Beautiful South?

Never been there, probably never will.

By Neil Ravenscroft (62.172.127.2) on Friday, November 05, 2004 - 01:18 pm:

On the other hand, they do have a nice home:

http://www.worldstad iums.com/stadium_pic tures/europe/united_ kingdom/england/york shire_humber/hull_ki ngston.shtml

Pity about the fans!

By Stu (13.16.137.11) on Friday, November 05, 2004 - 01:47 pm:

Maybe I'm reading too much into things, but I think Fryatt could be on his way.

After his blast from Merson last Saturday, Monday's press said he'd be in contention for a starting spot at Cheltenham. Low and behold, he wasn't fit despite indications before hand that he would be. 5 days later, he still isn't recovered and isn't playing any part tomorrow.

Bearing in mind what I was previously told and how annoyed Merson seemed with him last Saturday, I wonder if he is on his way out as soon as we've got a loan striker in.

By Neil Ravenscroft (62.172.127.2) on Friday, November 05, 2004 - 02:13 pm:

If he is, it means the Championship and (probably) less cash, as the Premiership window doesn't open until 1st Jan.

By Andrew Curl (82.37.161.56) on Friday, November 05, 2004 - 03:05 pm:

I can't believe the stripey pussy cats think the name 'Walsall' brings up images of dullness; F*ckin' Hull rhymes with Dull!!

Anyone who's seen the book "Crap Towns" and "Crap Towns 2" will have noticed Hull came number one crap town in one of them! (Not sure which one though)

By Leamore_Saddler (83.151.199.112) on Friday, November 05, 2004 - 07:24 pm:

Hull (or Kingston-upon-Hull as the snobbier residents call it) came top of the list of crap towns in volume 1 but had "dropped" to 19 in the list in volume 2. Apparently some local residents persuaded the publisher that it wasn't that bad. It seems, like us with the Art Gallery, to be a town with one well-hyped visitor attraction - "The Deep", an underwater experience!

Can't comment myself as my only visit was a brief one to the old Boothferry Park. No doubt tomorrow's visit to the KC Stadium will be equally brief but, I hope, a little happier.


By hullsaddler (213.249.178.194) on Friday, November 05, 2004 - 09:49 pm:

The council tried desperately for a while to get everyone to use Kingston-upon-Hull, a campaign doomed to failure in ull!
By the way Andrew,it is possible to buy "It's never dull in Hull" t-shirts at tourist information!
On a bright note Hull are without Delroy Facey,attacking midfield/ striker who according to a friend of mine (who has been to every game this season),has been their outstanding player.His place is going to one of 2 strikers with one goal between them this season.
Barmby has also been vg,more consistently so than Merson!

By WarsawPact (82.47.72.18) on Friday, November 05, 2004 - 10:13 pm:

"The Deep, an underwater experience"

Something like Gay Meadow then?

By Neil Ravenscroft (82.37.185.68) on Friday, November 05, 2004 - 11:35 pm:

Consdidering Delroy Facey got a hat trick against us last time we came up against him (he was on loan at Burnley from Bolton), I'm glad he's out! One of the players who might replace him, who has got that one goal this season, is a player people on here and on Rivals were saying we should go for a while back, when at Notts County, Danny Allsopp.

By JPD (203.18.34.5) on Saturday, November 06, 2004 - 03:40 am:

I keep coming accross interviews with Stuart Murdoch (MK Dons) where he says they man marked Merse out of the game making it 10 v 10.
Now if this should happen again, can Merse please pick the oppositions most effective bloke and man mark him, thus taking 2 or their players out of the game (or causing mass confusion and reshuffling to the opposition)?

By kevin (195.93.34.9) on Saturday, November 06, 2004 - 03:19 pm:

Weren't Walsall Council recently involved in advising HCCC in some capacity? If so,God help 'em.

By gizawfc (217.44.18.217) on Saturday, November 06, 2004 - 04:04 pm:

Well thats a bloody good start eh!!!!
Barmby 1st minutes and we sound like we are really up against it already!!!
9 bloody secs what the hell are we doing.

By Wednesbury Saddler# (82.37.177.173) on Saturday, November 06, 2004 - 04:35 pm:

2 - 0 Hull, why do we bother even looking?

By saddler88 (62.255.32.9) on Saturday, November 06, 2004 - 04:38 pm:

3-0 gd point

By PeedOff Saddler (81.153.39.76) on Saturday, November 06, 2004 - 04:38 pm:

Why send our team to play away from home when the Muppets obviously don't care about the club. Better to give a home win automatically and save the club the cost of ferrying those useless tossers up and down the country for matches.

Merson out! Mediocre season where we've become laughing stock of footballing world. Thanks for nothing you cockney junkie!

By Wednesbury Saddler# (82.37.177.173) on Saturday, November 06, 2004 - 04:40 pm:

I think if this gets embarassing all the 'good' work over the last few weeks (luton result) but this is an absolute joke, i dunno anymore, i seriously think we will get embarassed at slough, we are becoming a laughing stock.

By Wednesbury Saddler# (82.37.177.173) on Saturday, November 06, 2004 - 04:42 pm:

sorry, we ARE a laughing stock

By gizawfc (217.44.18.217) on Saturday, November 06, 2004 - 04:44 pm:

OH well time to turn off the match!!! Safe to say we are well and truly beaten after 40 mins!!!!

Big disapointment with recent performances, so we have to rely on the LDV trophy for something to cheer about this season.



By ste (143.210.168.61) on Saturday, November 06, 2004 - 04:46 pm:

Live text update and stats...

http://news.bbc.co.u k/sport1/hi/football /teams/w/walsall/liv e_text/default.stm

more of the play, less goals....

By PeedOff Saddler (81.153.39.76) on Saturday, November 06, 2004 - 04:58 pm:

We could 99% possession but we just can't play football! Simple as that - too afraid to run & shoot at goal - have to pass it 90 times before putting in a tame shot. No width, so everything has to go through Merse - so if he is taken out then we have nothing. Get him out the club before we're in league 2 in time for christmas!

MERSON OUT!!

By Pete North (84.65.138.166) on Saturday, November 06, 2004 - 05:02 pm:

We mirror Merson. Awesome at times, really cant be bothered the rest. Relegation looms Im afraid.

By Wednesbury Saddler# (82.37.177.173) on Saturday, November 06, 2004 - 05:06 pm:

3 -1 michael standing 48 mins

By kaneo (62.252.192.4) on Saturday, November 06, 2004 - 05:45 pm:

Its time for Bonser to listen to the fans,Merson must go now,to start the season with such optimisum which has now turned to trepidation,to think well be playing div 2 football next year is totaly unacceptable.

By Salop Saddler (213.78.59.132) on Saturday, November 06, 2004 - 06:09 pm:

Possession:
Hull 33%
Walsall 67%

Shots:
Hull 8
Walsall 21

Corners:
Hull 2
Walsall 7

Fouls:
Hull 10
Walsall 5

Investment past two seasons
Hull 3.2m
Walsall 0

Medium term ambition
Hull - intend to make the Premiership.
Walsall - Must aim to wipe out the legacy of the ITV digital collapse and reasses the situation when we're in a break even situation in a couple of years time.

Well, you can go on blaming the manager all you want, I for one certainly won't, just as I didn't when Colin Lee was the manager. And until such time as a person, or group of people come into this football club and put money on the table FOR ON THE FIELD INVESTMENT, things will remain the same.

By the way, and like it or not, today was the first time this season that Hull have been out possessed and out shot on their own ground.





By Neil Ravenscroft (82.37.185.68) on Saturday, November 06, 2004 - 06:26 pm:

You forgot the most important statistic of all HULL 3 WALSALL 1!!!!!!!!!!

By WSOne (81.178.207.198) on Saturday, November 06, 2004 - 06:33 pm:

No subs used again today!

By Cannock (82.37.171.99) on Saturday, November 06, 2004 - 06:37 pm:

So what, we lost AGAIN.

We have also failed to beat Torquay, Chesterfield, Wrexham, and got trounced by the mighty Oldham away from home.

I think our last away win was in 1802.

Merson Out.

By Cannock (82.37.171.99) on Saturday, November 06, 2004 - 06:39 pm:

Sorry, that was in reply to Salop's post

By hullsaddler (83.100.157.178) on Saturday, November 06, 2004 - 07:22 pm:

Well i thought at half time it was going to end up completely embarrassing 6 or 7 at least,but we had every opportunity to have ended up with something from that in the second half.
7 seconds -fastest goal I've ever seen-kick off, ball played wide straight onto foot of wide man,first time cross,back of the net.Whether Zigor was awake at this point am not sure.Talk about shell-shocked.Sure it must have affected us but there was no excuse for some of the mis-placed passing.We had lots of possession 15 yards either side of the halfway line,but nothing created.Too much sideways passing in my opinion.Merson especially guilty of giving it away or flicks over the top that did not reach anyone in a red shirt.
Not sure if Murphy should have done better with 2nd, as it seemed to be hit with little pace ,but a City friend of mine in the West stand thought it might have taken a deflection.Wright seemed a bit of a liability defending on the right & was too easily beaten(think it was him),before 3rd.My friend says their scorer normally has the pace of a snail & hardly ever beats anyone.
Could have been much worse by half time than it was.We looked hopeless,uninspiring ,insipid.
Merson should perhaps have done better with his chance but you could hardly say 3-0 flattered them.Thought Emblen was weak (should Roper return?) though his 'piledriver' shot was the highlight of his efforts.
Now if we had a striker who could put the ball in the net we could have won it in the 2nd half.We completely dominated the game.We started to actually run at their defence,Merson started playing some good balls for Wright & Zigor and Hull looked really rocky.Standing capped a wholehearted effort with a fine goal.IF ONLY we had someone during the 15-20 min onslaught after the goal who could have converted one of the numerous chances. Fryatt missed a sitter(though I did think he caused them problems especially when going wide). I love Jorge but I thought he was ineffective.I could not understand why we did not replace him & bring on some fresh legs,as I'm sure a 2nd would have seen them crumble.
Thought Standing was my m-o-m.Thought his excellent attitude was shown by his running to take corner right at the death .
If we play like we did in the first half for the rest of the season we will be relegated,if we dominate (& have someone to score)like the second half, we can still make the edge of the play offs.If we are as inconsistent as we were today we will end up in mid table mediocrity .
Not sure what any Slough scouts would have made of it.Probably went home at half time!



By Salop Saddler (213.78.59.132) on Saturday, November 06, 2004 - 07:29 pm:

No Neil, the most important stat is the FACT that we are a shoestring, two bit organisation who deserve to be exactly where they are in the league, with the pathetic level of investment which has been made available to both Colin Lee and even more so to Paul Merson.

The situation which is being brought about by the powers that be at Walsall is down to pounds, shillings and pence, nothing more, nothing less.

The players are not good enough, (though some may go on deluding themselves that they are) the manager is not exprienced enough (though both he and the team will continue to get my full and unswerving support) The point where I am beginning to draw the line however is with the owner. I'm sick and tired of seeing WFC stratching around continually seeking out the cheapest possible option, because while it may be fun when the cheap option comes off, inveriably the cheap option will at some stage lead us to where we are today. In a mess.

By dler (82.152.45.15) on Saturday, November 06, 2004 - 07:51 pm:

You're right Salop, it's absolutely disgraceful that the owner isn't a multi-millionaire! That he doesn't plough endless funds into a club that has no real fanbase! That he has put the club up for sale, but hasn't sold it to property developers/asset strippers because he wants the club to survive. Bonser out! Tooth fairy in!

By ken (194.6.9.129) on Saturday, November 06, 2004 - 08:08 pm:

Well Hull Saddler its been another bad day , but you have some very real more far reaching problems if Michael Standing is your Mom . I am down tonight and my Mom was just out Xmas shopping at Merry Hill , if your Mom is a 20 something bloke playing centre midfield, I'd recommend you have a long chat with your Dad about what's gone on.

By Me2 (82.37.32.69) on Saturday, November 06, 2004 - 08:17 pm:

Well said Salop, great post above.

By SheffieldSaddler (172.191.242.187) on Saturday, November 06, 2004 - 08:25 pm:

Well what can you say. Who is massively surprised by the result? I am not. It was expected. We cannot win away from home, or play away from home and Hull have a record of played 8, won 6, drawn 1 and lost 1 before today.
How anyone could have give us a chance I will never know. Your heart of course wants Walsall to win, but it was obvious your head would say we had little chance.
So another away match lost. 3 points away from relegation and still 9 points from play offs.
Although I admire the fans that want PM to stay, I really think you need to take a reality check. One point from nine in last 3 matches, when our form as supposedly improved. The season is practically over league wise, thats certain.
Oh, and if you gave PM a million quid, it would make NO DIFFERENCE. The bloke is not a manager and most certainll cannot motivate his work force.
The bloke should have gone after Doncaster away. Since then we have managed 9 points from 30.
Our season would have been back on track by now with a decent manager at the helm.
What a difference Ken Barlow as made.... NOT.

By cannock (82.37.171.99) on Saturday, November 06, 2004 - 08:27 pm:

I'm afraid i disagree - well to some extent anyway. I do agree that we are a two bit club that tries to do things on the cheap. That, unfortunately, is a fact of life.

However, as we have twice proven, you don't need to spend millions of pounds to get promoted. You need a lot of hard work, determination and most importantly organisation.

Sadly, in these departments we are somewhat lacking hence our current league position. I do not believe that a squad of players that competed in the Championship and almost survived is suddenly so poor that they are not good enough for league 1. That to me is down to poor management and organisation.

By cannock (82.37.171.99) on Saturday, November 06, 2004 - 08:30 pm:

My post was in reponse to Salop again, not you Sheff - time delay.

By K J C (195.188.152.10) on Saturday, November 06, 2004 - 08:40 pm:

I'm with Salop - great post mate.

How anyone could have expected us to turn 'ull over I'll never know.

I dont blame PM, I dont blame JB, I blame our finances and the people of Walsall for not supporting their local team.



By cannock (82.37.171.99) on Saturday, November 06, 2004 - 08:47 pm:

Why should we not be able to turn Hull over? If we have any aspirations of going up then that is exactly what we should be doing.

Anyhow, what about Doncaster, Torquay, Oldham, Chesterfield etc etc etc etc?

By K J C (195.188.152.10) on Saturday, November 06, 2004 - 09:00 pm:

I didnt say we shouldnt be able to turn them over, just that we shouldnt think that we have a god given right to.

The expectation levels ever since our play off win at Cardiff are just too high for a club of our size IMO.

Doncaster, Torquay, Oldham, Chesterfield etc etc etc etc ... Yes I agree... disappointing results - definately!

By Salop Saddler (213.78.59.132) on Saturday, November 06, 2004 - 09:01 pm:

Cannock, the side that 'almost survived' in the Championship was a poor one made barely average by Walker, Ritchie and Samways. One man doesn't make a team, but three go some way to making it. And dler, if it wasn't for cheapskatism of the very, and I repeat very, highest order, we may well of gleened the single point we needed to stay up last season when Colin Lee was refused permission to play Ritchie because it meant the club coughing up an extra three hundred quid a week for his services. Pathetic. As for selling the club, would anyone in their right mind want to buy it? The lucky purchaser wouldn't own the ground, they'd be saddled with an escalating ground rent, would be saddled with an escalating operating debt, and committed to contracted building projects with a dubious margin for profit. A truely assetless purchase if ever there was one So, all-in-all this football club IS for sale so to speak, but not really if you know what I mean. It's a bit like me selling you my car on the proviso that YOU pay the road fund licence, YOU put the petrol in, YOU pay the insurance and pay for the servicing, but you never get to drive it, only I get to do that.

By Geordiesaddler (195.92.67.69) on Saturday, November 06, 2004 - 09:07 pm:

I wonder whose turn it was to do the Rivals match report today? Well whether it was lolly nob-suck of stit for shathead I can't wait to read how enjoyable the first 8 seconds were. Really for anyone who loves to read how great we REALLY are just go there its great, apparently England want Merse to replace Sven but Bonser has issued a "pay up or hands off" warning.

Seriously I can hardly be bothered with any more of this nonsense. I am dreading Slough away, in fact I'm dreading the rest of this season as we battle to stay out of the fourth division. Just wake me up when apPAULing Mesron has gone. We've got some huge relegation games coming up before Christmas and if Mesron had any regard for this club or the fans that support it he would resign now. He is not capable of managing this club, a fact that has been patently obvoius (save for a couple of tantalising falsa dawns) since about the 50th minute at Oldham away, and certainly since about the same minute versus Doncaster.

Merson era? Merson Error more like. Hey if I do a few more funny play on words can I get do a rivals match report?

By Geordiesaddler (195.92.67.69) on Saturday, November 06, 2004 - 09:11 pm:

Salop I would love to tell you where to shove your stats and your argument and your admiral defence of the indefencible, but I just can't be bothered. If you honestly belive what you are posting on here then fair play to you. Football is a simple game, the team that scores most goals wins, that's my view.

By K J C (195.188.152.10) on Saturday, November 06, 2004 - 09:15 pm:

if you dont like the Rivals match reports - EASY - don't read them!

I really dont like this habit that some people have of dismissing (a) other peoples point of view and (b) other fan sites... it really makes you sound quite silly.

I dont frequent the Rivals site or many others really, this is the only WFC site that I have an interest in (apart from the Official one) but I certainly wouldnt run them down.

By coxanddrummie (82.36.16.10) on Saturday, November 06, 2004 - 09:23 pm:

I have to laugh when i see the pathetic responses of Salop Saddler. It's such a tedious arguement and a complete sidetrack to the real problem at the club which is the manager.

Salop and the like, you have short memories. It was only a few years ago that Ray Graydon elevated us into a higher league TWICE with far less quality at his disposal than Paul Merson. So in response and taking that into account, your old chesnut argument is flawed.

Do you want more examples. This time last year Crystal Palace were floundering at the bottom end of division 1 and no doubt there supporters or should we say the ill informed ones were spouting the same nonsense. A quality manager entered the club and got everything right from top to bottom with NO MONEY.

The rest is history. They are now batting halfway up the top league. It's sound management that will get the best out of this club and can you honestly say that Paul Merson is getting the best out of this team. Of course he isn't and anyone that thinks otherwise is WRONG.

The fact is that there are many examples of what good management can acheive, it's been proved time and time again with lots of clubs, ours included under Graydon.

Walsall is a club that will never have money, thats a fact. They can certainly have the opportunity to get a guy in that can get the best out of these players. If you take that into account i think there is enough quality to be up near the top.

That was proved against Luton. The problem however is that this manager can't do it on a consistant basis. we need to get someone in that can. NOW

By cannock (82.37.171.99) on Saturday, November 06, 2004 - 09:34 pm:

Much more eloquently put than my post Cox. Agree entirely.

By SheffieldSaddler (172.188.189.126) on Saturday, November 06, 2004 - 09:45 pm:

I find it amazing. We have excuse after excuse after excuse.
And people buy it, I cannot believe it.
Now its... Well if PM had some money, we would do better, lets feel sorry for him.
Well did not PM know he would have no money when he took over? Of course he did.
PM cannot motivate players. That is simple to see.
PM does not have any tactical know how. That is simple to see.
PM even cannot pick the right backroom staff.
PM cannot find decent players with the money he does have. That is simple to see.
Just face the facts people, give him as much money as you want. He does not have the skills to produce the goods.
Oh, and what has happened to the Ken Barlow era? 1 win, 1 draw and 2 loses. Marvellous.


By Jorge14 (195.93.34.9) on Saturday, November 06, 2004 - 10:04 pm:

Of the shambles we saw today, there is hardly anyone who can hold their head up high.
Michael Standing is the only player who can be totally proud of their performance, Neil Emblen and Julian Bennett also had decent games.

But that is it. I think Leitao is finished, and we are relying too much on Fryatt. We were on top for the first twenty minutes of the second half, and we could have got back into it. THeir right back was awful, and maybe the pace of Darryl Taylor could of tipped the balance. Also, however sh!t people say he is, the Hull defence we worried with the crosses, so maybe Birch's prescense (he is a big lad, and takes a player with him whether he is crap or not) could have helped.

Cr to Hull for the first, they caught us whilst we were still asleep, Barmby did the only thing he did all match and scored. Osborn never tracked him like he did for the rest of the game (cr to Osborn, Barmby was anonymous). Zigor was poor for the first, and was asleep. off at a tangent, he looked liek a prat in the second half. A Fvcking jumper on...

Mark Wright is an excuse. Just an awful, awful performance. He improved along with the rest of the team at the start of the second half, put some dangerous crosses in. But the fact remains that his general ball is awful, he has little positional sense, he is weak in the tackle, and has no physical strength. His only asset is his pace.

There was talk of relegation in the first half. Its not a stupid idea.

Finally, another thing wound me up to day. The singing of "loyal supporters". Yes, we are back to the 'loyal' thing. What total bollocks that is... My god, i went to see England play the other and I dont have enough money to go and watch Walsall play at Cheltenham in the apparent worst performance of the season. If that makes me unloyal, then so be it. The fact that I have been to more football grounds than most people my age with Walsall doesn't mean anything. I'm unloyal...

By Salop Saddler (213.78.59.132) on Saturday, November 06, 2004 - 10:06 pm:

Geordie, I care no more for stats than anyone else, plus they're not mine but the BBC's. I mearly used them to illustrate the point about our lack of ambition, so if you take a sideways look at my post you'll read that the last thing I'm doing is defending the club. If you can't see that then YOU shove it wherever YOU want. The only indefencible thing that I can see is that the owner of this football club (and I stress the OWNER) has made a catalogue of errors from finding himself controling the most successful side in our history, to one on the brink of.

As for Cox. Well you're so rich, and you've got such style and great teeth, why don't you buy WFC, I could do with a laugh at the moment. But you know what, you won't buy the football club will ya??? Not an effin chance. With regard to Crystal Palace, they spent a couple of million pounds assembling a •••• team, which was moulded into a good one by a good manager. So don't say they spent no money, because they did. And Ray Graydon? the man's a living saint, plus, incredibly, he was the last Walsall manager to spend any 'money' on a transfer. That, for me, sums it all up in a nutshell. Ambition? Saddlers? like yeah.

By coxanddrummie (82.36.16.10) on Saturday, November 06, 2004 - 10:24 pm:

So Salop do you honestly think that money would somehow make Merson a better manager. The man could have an open checkbook for 5 year he still wouldn't get us top half of this league. The man is just a completely cack manager, preiod.

I can't comprehend this no money arguement. I mean i give you examples and you just sidetrack them because you haven't the balls to face the facts. People like you say things like "well maybe Merson should move upstairs and let someone else take over the team"

You have to be ruthless. There is no room for sentiment in football. Just take Dave Jones. He got the sack last week and rightly so. Based on his faliures why should Merson still be here. It's all relative, in fact i feel Merson has more of a right to be sacked based on the fact that Jones was batting at Premiership level. A far bigger divide that there is between Div 1 and 2.

For this club to move on Paul Merson and his men have to depart. I personally beleive the season in terms of promotion has gone now anyway. The reason i want a new man is to save us from relegation. Im teling you now, under Merson this club will go down

By Salop Saddler (213.78.59.132) on Saturday, November 06, 2004 - 10:30 pm:

Sheffield. No, I not advocating showering Merson with cash, it's too f@cking late to be doing that, but I will not, ever, do anything other that support the manager and players, all the time, every time. That's my right and that's what I'll do. You do whatever you want, that's you're right so just do it. The thing that enrages me are the people running the club, with their mealy mouthed platitudes about this being a well run club. Crap I say. Utter crap. Less than a year ago we could have done something as a team. We'd have got change out of two hundred thousand for both Baird and O'neill, both of whom wanted to come here for christ sake. We refused to stump up a few quid to keep our best defender in team when we most needed him, and where has it all got us, this 'well run club' clap trap? It's got us where we are today. Well i'm f@cked off with it all and I'm going to watch a couple of me Fred Dibnah tapes, Good night everyone.

By Magic Man Fan (81.155.26.10) on Saturday, November 06, 2004 - 10:30 pm:

Salop, while none of us expected to wipe the floor with Hull, we do expect a team that:

a) is organised and has some understanding of tactics
b) competes with effort
c) doesn't give the ball away to the opposition all the time
d) is capable/willing to shoot from outside the box
e) gives a cack about the club paying their wages

A team of 15 year olds could do this even if they lost every week. I don't mind us losing if we're giving 100%.

No physical prescence in midfield especially, but then we all knew that at the start of the season but remember Merse said we don't need a ball winner or a Martin O Connor type as teams in this division will give you possession. Rubbish! His first rickett. Thinking about it though he is right. There is a team that gives away possession to the opposition...namely us. Osborn being the most regular culprit but everyone was at it today. I saw Wrack, Standing, Zigor, Emblen, Wright and Merson all give the ball away more than once today when under no pressure.

Once again we played for 20 minutes out of the 90 and once again for that 20 minutes we looked great with the tempo and incisive passing to the front two and out wide (yes out wide) that was missing in the rest of the game.

It annoyed me a bit because I'm at the point where I'm realising that the longer things go on the more likely we are to be involved in a relegation battle rather than one for the play offs. Merse bought himself some time with the second half performance where most fans were ready to shoot him at half time.

Merse if you're reading this, why no changes? At the start of the season we were making changes for fun when we didn't need to, now we don't when we're desparate for a sub. Why do we only seem to get plenty of crosses over when Birch isn't playing? Why not get them over when he is on the pitch?

Still don't think Jorge is worth his place in the team for what he does, I can run around for 90 minutes without doing a lot. He got the ball in a few good positions today but tried to back heel or play someone else in when he should be shooting. He's a f****** striker for f**** sake. He's not selfish enough to score as many goals as he should.

I hope Slough are decent odds next week cos my money is going on them.

Oh, and Salop. If you listen to Peter Taylor he rates a lot of our players very highly and would seemingly kill for our midfield from his after match comments. Regardless of what you think about this team/sqaud, I know with the right manager we'd be in the top 6 by now. Do you think Chesterfield, Hartlepool or Bournemouth have a stonger, more expensive squad than us? They are much more likely to be challenging for the top 6 than us.

Do you think most of the players we've got come cheap? You might be surprised to know what some of them earn. Incidentally its the higher earners are the ones who aren't performing consistently proving that its not about money, its about having a manager that can get the best out his players and getting them organised and committed.

Its also about stopping his team repeatedly making the same mistakes. They're making the same mistakes because the tactics are wrong, we still haven't got a ball winner and we haven't got any width. You don't need money to solve these problems.

By Magic Man Fan (81.155.26.10) on Saturday, November 06, 2004 - 10:33 pm:

Jorge - I don't think it was a jumper Zigor was wearing, more like long gloves. Poof. If I was his manager I'd say you're not leaving the dressing room till you get those off. It wasn't even cold.

By SheffieldSaddler (172.190.54.84) on Saturday, November 06, 2004 - 10:34 pm:

If PM has any pride he would walk out of Walsall FC.
It is obvious that the bloke as NO management skills whatsoever.
He is a liability, the players do not perform for him on a regular basis.
The players and backroom staff he has brought to Walsall are useless.
Bewers? What the hell happened there? What a waste of 3 months wages.
Then there is the brilliant goalkeepers he brought in.
The list is endless.
He did not even need to do anything with players like Bennett and Fryatt, they were left for him on a plate, he just had to pick them.
Since PM took over manager of Walsall FC, we have rapidly gone down hill. We have not won an away match and had to go to penalties to beat a team, that a few years ago were in the vauxhall conference.
The quicker this poor excuse for a manager leaves Walsall FC the better for all.

By hullsaddler (213.249.245.194) on Saturday, November 06, 2004 - 10:36 pm:

Yes,Ken , a sordid family secret that I've never felt able to talk about it till now.

By SheffieldSaddler (172.190.54.84) on Saturday, November 06, 2004 - 10:37 pm:

MMF - You have finally seen the light. Took you longer enough, but I had every faith you would get there in the end.

By Magic Man Fan (81.155.26.10) on Saturday, November 06, 2004 - 10:41 pm:

Salop, £200,000 for O Neil AND Baird???

You're having a Giraffe aren't you? If that was the case, why didn't Watford sign Baird? Then where would we find the £5000-6000 wages they'd expect each?

And considering we had then just announced losses of £1m do you think that would have been good business? Do you want to see us go out of business and have no team to support at all?

Support the team but not the board or club? Seems odd to me.

By Salop Saddler (213.78.59.132) on Saturday, November 06, 2004 - 10:42 pm:

WILL PEOPLE PLEASE REALISE THE POINT I AM TRYING TO MAKE. We would not be in this position now if the owner had have committed himself to the cause last year when it needed doing. JUNIOR, BAIRD, O'NEILL, RITCHIE. ALL money issues, ALL lost opportunities, ONE COCK UP AFTER ANOTHER. If Bonser had done the things he should have done, we'd have still been in the championship, we'd have still been managed by our most successful manager, ever. We'd have been getting gates of near enough 10,000 every home match, AND WE WOULDN'T BE IN THE ••••• POSITION THAT WE'RE IN NOW. PLEASE TELL ME THAT YOU CAN SEE MY POINT.

By Magic Man Fan (81.155.26.10) on Saturday, November 06, 2004 - 10:45 pm:

Answer my last post.

Until you personally put the money up, shut up. The club hasn't got the kind of money to sign the above players. Full stop. No argument. Cloud cuckoo land.

The club slashed prices last season to average 8,000 but still people of Walsall wouldn't support their team. What more can the club do?

By ken (195.153.124.163) on Saturday, November 06, 2004 - 10:49 pm:

Crikey , if MMF is starting to lose faith then things are bleak . Reckon he and Albert Gilsop on Rivals are the two Saddlers on line who always look for any positives going .

I thought it before the Colchester game that it was must win for Merson to survive . Now I think we have to stay in Fa Cup ; then take an absolute minimum of 4 points from the 2 league games from Posh H and Stockport A .

If this doesnt happen , I think we need a change . Trouble is , we lose the manager , we lose our best player ( at least some of the time he is , ie when we play well)

What a mess .

Up the Saddlers

By ken (194.6.9.129) on Saturday, November 06, 2004 - 10:53 pm:

My post was in reply to MMF's review of the match , not the last post

By Magic Man Fan (81.155.26.10) on Saturday, November 06, 2004 - 10:54 pm:

Sheff - I still think Merson could be successful but only when he's prepared to learn from his mistakes which he doesn't seem capable of doing.

I said after the Kiddy pre season game that we let in 3 of those goals that day from not closing down players quickly enough allowing them to get to the edge of the box and get a shot in. Incidentally we hardly ever attempt this. We did today and Standing scored. Exactly the same thing happened for 2 of their goals today. Backing off and backing off, I can almost read Osborn's lips (he's the worst culprit for it) saying come on, keep coming, thats it a bit closer, you'll be able to get a shot in soon...DAMN, he's scored, wish I'd got a tackle in instead of watching Darren Bazeley style.

By CND FAN (195.93.34.9) on Saturday, November 06, 2004 - 10:56 pm:

EVERYONE IS LOOKING TO PIN THE BLAME HERE, THERE OR EVERYWHERE.

HOW ABOUT STICKING TOGETHER AND TRYING TO GET OUT OF THIS MESS.

By SheffieldSaddler (172.190.54.84) on Saturday, November 06, 2004 - 10:58 pm:

Salop as a point.
1. The club would not play Ritchie for the sake of saving a few quid.
2. When we were a few points of play offs, the club would not invest a few quid to get a decent striker on board. Well, they led us to believe they wanted to, but it was BULLSH!T and you all know it.
3. The comparison to Walsall, to selling the car is CORRECT.

By Salop Saddler (213.78.59.132) on Saturday, November 06, 2004 - 11:01 pm:

200k Baird and O'neill. It's a fact I'm afraid. O'Neil will sign for Cardiff for £75k when his loan period is up, you wait and see. It's what Portsmouth wanted for him then, it's what Portsmouth want for him now.

And everytime I pass through the gate at Bescot, I personally put money into the club, as I have done in various ways for forty years. So no, I won't 'shut up', because I DO put up.

And if you want to see the finest example of CRAP business, your last point did that for me. That's where the cash for wages SHOULD have come from for the likes of Baird and O'Neil. Slashing prices at a time they should have been increased? A farce. Slashing our own throats more like. A stupid business gamble and one for which we paid the penalty.

By Salop Saddler (213.78.59.132) on Saturday, November 06, 2004 - 11:05 pm:

Sheff, thank you for seeing my point. Please, anybody, disagree with it, but please, just see it.

By SheffieldSaddler (172.190.54.84) on Saturday, November 06, 2004 - 11:08 pm:

MMF - I have been part of working life for the last 18 years. I have come across GREAT managers and I have come across CRAP managers.
Thing is, you can tell with experience so easy now, even after a few dealings, what category a manager falls into.
PM will never make a manager, EVER.
Too much distractions in his life for a start.
Never learns from his mistakes like you say.
And most of alll, does not how to utilise, manage or get the most out of his workforce.

By Magic Man Fan (81.155.26.10) on Saturday, November 06, 2004 - 11:30 pm:

Sorry Salop but we forked out those sorts of wages last year and look at the debt we've got into as a result and I really can't beleive that Cardiff will sign O Neil for £75,000.

When I meant put up, I meant the sort of money to sign these players. You put up but tell 10,000 other people in Walsall to then your point is valid.

Other clubs have took gambles and they have ended up in dire financial circumstances and will take years to recover.

In theory I agree with you, signing Baird, Vincent, O Neil and Junior would have made us a force to be reckoned with but we couldn't financially justify it.

We had a squad last season capable of being a success, I really beleive that but the way they were sent out to play meant the MOST we could hope fore was survival. They should have been told they were good enough for the play offs not just achieving 50 points.

Bonser backed Lee last season and the season before as the balance sheets show and look where it has got us in terms of league position and debt.

By SheffieldSaddler (172.188.21.92) on Saturday, November 06, 2004 - 11:41 pm:

MMF - You keep going on about Bonser backing CL.
Can you please tell me then -
1. What was CLs budget last season?
2. What was CLs budget the season before?
3. What was RGs budget when he was in charge?
Thanks.
I would like to see figures on this rather than the normal, Bonser backed CL and looked what happened there argument

By SheffieldSaddler (172.188.21.92) on Saturday, November 06, 2004 - 11:41 pm:

MMF - You keep going on about Bonser backing CL.
Can you please tell me then -
1. What was CLs budget last season?
2. What was CLs budget the season before?
3. What was RGs budget when he was in charge?
Thanks.
I would like to see figures on this rather than the normal, Bonser backed CL and looked what happened there argument

By Jorge14 (195.93.34.9) on Saturday, November 06, 2004 - 11:45 pm:

Can we not get into another Colin Lee debate?

The 217th debate was boring, so i'm sure the 218th won't be any different.

By Neil Ravenscroft (82.37.185.68) on Sunday, November 07, 2004 - 12:53 am:

MMF, I see we have another convert to the "dark side"! It's all very well Salop going on about lack of investment in the side (and he makes some very valid points), but, I firmly believe that the current squad is better than the one that got us promoted under Graydon the first time and, possibly, better than that which got us up the second. It is certainly far, far better than the current league position. No argument at all. It is, however, being grossly misused and has not been reinforced in the summer, other than by adding more of the same, rather than something different.
Go back and look at match reports from August onwards and the same things are continually said - weak on the flanks, because of the formation, both attacking and defending, no options on the bench to change things. The lessons are just not being learned and only one man can be held responsible.
You said you will always back the team and the manager - I'm afraid the time comes when it's impossible to do both, it's a matter of choosing between them.
Just one other thing - someone said that, if we lose our manager, we lose our best player. The answer to that is only sometimes. Someone on Rivals said a while ago that the best five performances they'd ever seen in a Walsall shirt were from Merson. A huge exaggeration, but I know what they meant. The trouble is, I've probably seen the amongst the worst five from him as well. When his head ain't there, he don't turn up and spends the entire game giving the ball away and then standing with his hands on his hips watching the game go past. I'd much rather have someone who worked harder - or at least a left winger who gave us some different options.

By TofDover (195.92.67.78) on Sunday, November 07, 2004 - 12:56 am:

Player Managers very rarely work. You canot be one of the boys and then have to give orders as a boss its counterproductive, and you loose respect I think PM should decide which cap he should wear

By Neil Ravenscroft (82.37.185.68) on Sunday, November 07, 2004 - 12:58 am:

I'll give you a clue - it's conical, with a big "D" on the front!

By Geordiesaddler (195.92.168.177) on Sunday, November 07, 2004 - 01:10 am:

KJC I was advocating people go there, optimism - or should I say surealism is a great antidote to what's actually happening on the pitch.

Salop what has lack of ambition got to do with getting stuffed by Hull? Are Chesterfield, Brentford, Oldham etc. more ambitious than us?

As for the stats on posession and shots you could probably pull similar stats for every game we've lost this season, problem is we keep missing chances and shipping goals - because (clears throat, groans, and can't actually believe I'm going to post this again) WE ARE EASY TO PLAY AGAINST. I'll try a few variations on previous descriptions just to keep my brain alive.

Paceless.
Narrow.
Apologetic in front of goal.
Putrid in defence.
Tactically one dimensional.
Gutless in the tackle.
Innacurate in the passing department.

Rubbish and heading for division 4 with a squad of players that should at least be challenging for the play offs, one of the biggest squads in the division I might add.


By cannock (82.37.171.99) on Sunday, November 07, 2004 - 02:23 am:

Oh cack. I agree with Neil.

By kevin (195.93.34.9) on Sunday, November 07, 2004 - 03:09 am:

Fully agree with Salop Saddler.The "floggin a car analogy " is spot on.

I would suggest to the "Bonser saved Walsall" merchants,that anything achieved by Messrs Graydon and Lee,was in spite of,not because of him.

There were others!!!!!!!

By Wednesbury Saddler# (82.37.177.173) on Sunday, November 07, 2004 - 04:52 am:

everyone knows we shud not be in this position, 6 points off the play offs in december? that was the time when mr.bonser could have got his chequebook out n we would have quite possibly finished in the top 10 last year, but what? o its the same old scenario.... lqck of ambition at the highest level.

By Neil Ravenscroft (82.37.185.68) on Sunday, November 07, 2004 - 10:57 am:

That might eb the case for last season, but we are talking this. Lokk at the teams above us:-

Luton Town, Tranmere Rovers, Hull City, AFC Bournemouth, Bradford City, Brentford, Chesterfield, Hartlepool United, Swindon, Bristol City, Huddersfield Town, Sheffield Wednesday, Port Vale, Doncaster Rovers, Colchester United, Wrexham, Barnsley.

I might give you the likes of Bristol City, Weddy and Luton, but are you seriously trying to tell me some of the others have better squads, more ambition and more resources than us? Pull the other one!

By Salop Saddler (213.78.59.132) on Sunday, November 07, 2004 - 12:31 pm:

Neil/Geordie. The 'ambition' lies in the board room with the vast majority of the clubs you've listed Neil. Our major ambitions revolve around M6 advertising hoardings, motels, and car park extentions. It's only then that we get anywhere near on the field ambitions. Lets test the ambition of the owner and say to him waive the rent for the next three years, invest it in the team, and recoup part of your losses by selling off a chunk of your share holding.

As for the quality of our players. I doubt not for one moment that man for man this group of players are far superior to those managed by Graydon during either of his promotion seasons. But as a team they simply do not work. And that isn't always down to the manager. And I make my case by pointing to the 1966 World Cup winning team of Sir Alf's. Geoff Hurst better than Jimmy Greaves? I think not, but in terms of the team? Yes, every time.

By Geordiesaddler (195.92.168.163) on Sunday, November 07, 2004 - 12:42 pm:

Salop, sorry but how do you know the ambition lies in the board room of "the vast majority" of those clubs? Are you party to this knowledge? Many of the above clubs "ambition" over the last few years has been 1) to survive at all, 2) to emulate us in being able to improve their infrastructure whilst having success on the pitch, and 3) To achieve number 2 whilst returning sound financial performance off the pitch.

The likes of Chesterfield, Brentford, Colchester etc. are light years behind us. However they employ football managers who get the very best out of their extremely limited resources in the very way that Graydon did at Bescot. They are in fact following our lead of 5/6 years ago, its us that's lost the plot by employing a "manager" with no experience, no knowledge of the lower divisions. The reason our team "doesn't work" is because of the way the players are used by the manager. The formation, the selection, the tactics, the fitness and motivation levels are all the manager's responsibility and its those areas where we are second best to Neil's list of teams. What the hell has that got to do with the board room?

By Will (212.125.68.234) on Sunday, November 07, 2004 - 12:48 pm:

Not much more to say really - a manager who cannot play more than one type of game, a manager who can't motivate the team, a manager who can't organise the side, a manager who has too many off the field problems, a player manager who only has one good game in five, a player manager who can't handle being one of the boys as well as manager (reminds me of Steve Claridge in the football documentary a few months ago). I really can't be bothered with Walsall anymore. Unless the management changes we're doomed in the league. Can't see us beating Orient who are doing well in League 2. Any team with organisation and a work ethic will beat us away - Cheltenham gave us a run for our money and Slough will too.
As for Bonser - simple answer - we haven't got the money to spend, Colin Lee went over budget to the tune of about a Million, Bonser backed him 'cos he believed in him. Now he's getting slaughtered for not spending more. Do you really want us to go out of business Salop?
We've got a 5hit fan base, an owner who hasn't got the funds to invest millions and we can't attract big money sponsors because of the competition from other local teams. You can't blame Bonser.
Any of the other teams above us in the league would love to have the size and quality of squad that we have, most of them only have about 16 players to choose from, we've got about 8 midfielders. Again that's down to Merse. Let's just agree it was an experiment that went wrong and get rid of him before he does any more damage.

By Geordiesaddler (195.92.168.163) on Sunday, November 07, 2004 - 01:08 pm:

Exactly Will spot on. We have to deal with our own circumstances not worry about other people's. The circumstances you outline make it imperitive that we have a team manager who knows exactly what he is doing, one that is capable of working within our constraints to get the maximum out of our resources. We are not the worst supported club in this league - far from it, we are certainly not the most financially crippled so to use that as an excuse for the current on the field problems is just a smokescreen.

Bonser has backed Merson with signings, and has stuck by him.
Look at the number of signings Merson has made that have come to nothing. Mckinney, Bewers, Broad, Dakinah? He has also been able to sign the likes of Kinsella and Murphy - quality at this level, and been able to offer terms to all the players from last season's squad he wanted to keep - PLUS Darren Byfield. I really don't see how Bonser can be accused of not providing Merson with enough resource to build a decent squad. What we need is a manager who can use what resource we have to best effect, and Merson is a million miles away from that.

This could still be a successful season. We have two winnable cup-ties that could lead us to exciting cup-runs and financial reward. Incredibly we are still only 9 points off the play-offs. We have some huge games coming up in the next month and I would love to see us have a manager in place who can get us the results we need. I just don't trust Merson to get us successfully through this next month. Like Will says lets get rid and get back to basics 4-4-2 with some width and also solidarity down the middle. Lets entrust the next month to FB without the Merson enigma to complicate matters and we might actually get ourselves into a decent position.

By wfc_2uk (62.31.217.64) on Sunday, November 07, 2004 - 01:58 pm:

I cannot believe that start yesterday. I was all relaxed ready for a good game and after 7 seconds I was back on my chair and really worrying about yet another relegation.
Everyone was awful yesterday apart from Standing.
Whats the point in playing 4-3-1-2 when our full backs cant cross? OK the 4-3-1-2 formation worked when we had vincent and Baird but with wright and zigor they aint got what it takes to ping a decent ball across. Fryatt is good enough but thinks hes too good for the club and Jorge just isnt worth £150 let alone £150,000 anymore.

We all want it too succeed for merse but we have got to be honest and say it wont. Merson is a great bloke but crap at his job. The bloke is too nice. I agree whats Barlow done since hes been here? Nothing. This is the lowest ive felt supporting the saddlers.

Merson wont get sacked if fans clap the players off at full time and sing Paul Mersons barmy army when we score a goal to make it 3-1!!
18th in div 2, three points and places to the drop door to the worsty leaue in the fotball league! Bring back kenny
Ive been to every game this season but I am not going to Slough or Stockport because I dont see what the point is of wasting my money to watch them low lifes put in no effort.
God times are depressing.

By wfc_2uk (62.31.217.64) on Sunday, November 07, 2004 - 02:03 pm:

I am fed up with these "MIGHTS". Last season it was we might get a result at Palace, sheff uted or rotherham to stay up. Now its we might win the cup games, we might close the 9 point gap! For gods sake look at the table 3 points and places from the drop. Merse out

By cannock (82.37.171.99) on Sunday, November 07, 2004 - 02:35 pm:

I rarely agree Geordie but your last but one post is spot on. Will also sums up our situation rather well.

By wfc_2uk (62.31.217.64) on Sunday, November 07, 2004 - 02:42 pm:

also considering we played 120 minutes plus penalties tuesday night, WHY did he not make a sub? Me and afew others spoke to Broad before the ame and admitted that travelling for 3 and half hours on the morning of the game tired the lads out but insisted hes travelled alot futher. CHEAP CHEAP F*****G CHEAP. Cant even afford accomodation before a game, this has got Grimsby written all over it.

By Andrew Curl (82.37.161.56) on Sunday, November 07, 2004 - 03:42 pm:

What's that smashing noise?
Oh it's alright; just promotion going out the window.

By wfc_2uk (62.31.217.64) on Sunday, November 07, 2004 - 03:47 pm:

no andrew its probably all the players fallin on their arses through the trap door to league 2.

By Andrew Curl (82.37.161.56) on Sunday, November 07, 2004 - 03:52 pm:

Not sure about relegation just yet, although i admit it's a possibility; but promotion is more or less gone now. Boring boring lower-half team!

By Chorley Saddler (195.93.34.9) on Sunday, November 07, 2004 - 04:02 pm:

Wanted Forward,Midfielder and Right Back.

Also why where Locko and his tosser mates singing that crap song about Loyal Supporters yesterday. People do have families work on weekends. So why do him and his scrubber Walsall Youth mates sing song like that.


By Bristol Fan (195.92.67.77) on Sunday, November 07, 2004 - 04:30 pm:

Oh well, I was at a different match again. We were ten times better than against Milton Keynes or Cheltenham. Hull had four shots to write home about and scored three of them - Murphy should have done better and our full backs were both utterly dire. In the first half we were somewhat unlucky to go in with the scoreline we did (but had only ourselves to blame) but we were awesome in the second half and would have scored 6 or 7 on a different day. The difference was the lack of a clinical finisher up front. Fryatt and Leitao weren't good enough.

Here's a statistic for you. We've scored 8 in 8 with Leitao and Fryatt starting up front, and 18 in 9 with Birch plus either Leitao and Fryatt. That says a lot.

Our midfield was outstanding, Osborn in particular. Merson had a poor first half and a majestic second one. Standing continues to look better with every game. Wrack gave the ball away a bit but generally played well too.

Required: two full backs and a centre forward. We'd have won the game with that.

I know we lost - AGAIN - but this is a game we were expected to lose, most of us would have expected to lose before the season even started, and at least one where I saw one of our best 45 minutes of football in a long time.


By Magic Man Fan (81.155.26.10) on Sunday, November 07, 2004 - 04:37 pm:

Sorry Bristol, good performances count for nowt when we can't score, can't defend and only play for 20 minutes out of the 90.

I forgot about that wfc_2uk - I was astonished when lots of our fans clapped the team off at half time. I'm not one for booing but there was no way I was going to applaud the cr@p we'd seen for the first 45 minutes.

By rolo (82.37.186.224) on Sunday, November 07, 2004 - 05:20 pm:

our midfield outstanding?they were non existant in the first half.and as for the second half.could we have played any worse?

By rolo (82.37.186.224) on Sunday, November 07, 2004 - 05:20 pm:

our midfield outstanding?they were non existant in the first half.and as for the second half.could we have played any worse?

By coxanddrummie (82.36.16.10) on Sunday, November 07, 2004 - 05:38 pm:

"I know we lost - AGAIN - but this is a game we were expected to lose, most of us would have expected to lose before the season even started"

Speak for yourself Bristol fan. What a neg head you are. Last season we were 2 league's apart from Hull and YOU expect us to lose.

Im glad you ain't the manager with an attitude like that. You are in a minority of 1 who would actually be worse that our current pathetic excuse for a boss.

By Neil Ravenscroft (82.37.185.68) on Sunday, November 07, 2004 - 06:19 pm:

Personally, I'm with the Hull Rivals site match report:-

"Walsall tried to play everything through their manager to the point of detriment to themselves. Ten to fifteen nice passes, work the ball to Merson, ambitious ball is attempted to unlock the opposition defence. Fails every single time. Every single time is not an exaggeration either. Not once did Merson find a way to break down the opposition thanks to a dearth of talent around him, his incessantness on trying the most difficult ball without exception, and some resolute Tigers defending".

Everything through the manager? Ambitious ball is attempted to try and unlock the oppositin defence? Trying the most difficult ball without exception? Those phrases could have been used in virtually every match report this season.


By Andrew Curl (82.37.161.56) on Sunday, November 07, 2004 - 06:31 pm:

Cox, we may have been leagues apart last season but we aren't anymore, and as it stands they are also above us by many places. True, it is a dire situation but it's the situation as it stands.
I agree with Sheff's comment, your heart wants Walsall to win but your head knows we have little chance.

By Stu (195.92.67.68) on Sunday, November 07, 2004 - 07:05 pm:

I wish people wouldn't go on about the improved 2nd half performance either. We were 3 0 down by that points.

Its easy to play well when your 3 0 down and the match is beyond you and the opposition have taken the foot of the pedal.

I was prepared to give Merson time, I really thoughe he'd started to turn it around. But now I'm facing up to the fact that its not working.

History tells you that if your facing a relegation battle come Xmas, your facing a relegation battle come April/May. We're really not far off it and we're more likely to be within 6 pts of relegation than 6 pts of the play offs come Xmas at this rate.

If he really wants to save his job, he has to start getting nasty. If that means transfer listing half a dozen players, then do it now and get somebody in. Either this lot need a rocket up their arse, or they just don't care.

By Geordiesaddler (195.92.67.65) on Sunday, November 07, 2004 - 07:35 pm:

Andrew - you're not sure we are in a relegation battle? The only teams below us in the league we've played so far Franchise and Torquay draws, Oldham defeat. Against who exactly are we suddenly going to start winning? We have been consistenly sh!t since the start of the season. The few of us that commented on this at the time were ridiculed, now thankfully most reasonable people are starting to realise how bad things are and are voicing opinions to boot. Worthy of ridicule are the idiots who clap the team off after every sorry defeat, and they are IDIOTS- only interested in their point proving over CL and sadly oblivious as to the club's terrible current predicament. I've never known anything like it to be honest.

By Salop Saddler (213.78.59.132) on Sunday, November 07, 2004 - 07:46 pm:

Geordie. I think you're out of order calling fellow Saddlers idiots, particularly those willing to travel to watch the team away from home. The only idiot at Bescot is the IDIOT who constantly looks for the cheap option. The IDIOT who sacked our most successful manager and then refused to play our best player because it meant paying him a bit more cash. There's the true IDIOT.

By SheffieldSaddler (172.186.253.56) on Sunday, November 07, 2004 - 08:09 pm:

Bristol Fan - I dont see the point of your stat in regards Birch. If Birch starts a match and goes off and we happen to score after this, is this included in your "and 18 in 9 with Birch plus either Leitao and Fryatt."?
As we have not scored 18 goals with Birch on the pitch. Thats a fact.

By Exile (203.167.253.205) on Sunday, November 07, 2004 - 08:16 pm:

Idiot. Thought you had more sense than that, Salop. You're acting like a schoolkid who's been disappointed to open his Christmas present to find a cheap clone doll instead of the Action Man he wanted.



By Stu (195.92.67.70) on Sunday, November 07, 2004 - 08:25 pm:

If Bristol's stat is true, although I do have the same question that Sheff has, then it only backs up my viewpoint that Birch

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