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Millwall (A) League 1 Saturday 15/9/07.

Reports and reaction from the 2007-08 season as Walsall finished 12th in League 1
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Magic Man Fan
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Sun Sep 16, 2007 9:13 pm

priestley_saddler wrote:Sonner - I'm struggling to take to this guy. His set pieces never ook threatening


?!?!?! His set pieces have generally been excellent. Just that in most cases no one has been on the end of them.

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Sun Sep 16, 2007 9:26 pm

priestley_saddler wrote:Roper - Would have been MOTM had he not got injured so early. Made one top tackle as mentioned above and got injured blocking a shot. Surely nobody can still think he's past his best?

He was at his best playing alongside Ritchie in the Championship, as you'd expect.
I don't think he's lost it all but do wonder what the future holds for him when he struggles to complete 90 minutes of football (albeit in unfortunate circumstances).

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Sun Sep 16, 2007 9:43 pm

Magic Man Fan wrote:
priestley_saddler wrote:Sonner - I'm struggling to take to this guy. His set pieces never ook threatening


?!?!?! His set pieces have generally been excellent. Just that in most cases no one has been on the end of them.

But even when people are in the right places the chance is made all the more difficult by the fact that they have to generate all they're own power. His deliveries lack pace, and this gives the defenders an extra second or so to get in a position to clear it. He seems to float it in when sometimes I'd wish he zip it in inviting someone to really attack it.

WFC_Rob wrote:
priestley_saddler wrote:Roper - Would have been MOTM had he not got injured so early. Made one top tackle as mentioned above and got injured blocking a shot. Surely nobody can still think he's past his best?

He was at his best playing alongside Ritchie in the Championship, as you'd expect.
I don't think he's lost it all but do wonder what the future holds for him when he struggles to complete 90 minutes of football (albeit in unfortunate circumstances).

I think in the last two games he's playing somewhere near his best. He looked fit yesterday, as you say its unfortunate he didn't complete 90 minutes and had nothing to do with him not being good enough.
Last edited by priestley_saddler on Sun Sep 16, 2007 9:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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booster cogburn
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Sun Sep 16, 2007 9:43 pm

Magic Man Fan wrote:
priestley_saddler wrote:Sonner - I'm struggling to take to this guy. His set pieces never ook threatening


?!?!?! His set pieces have generally been excellent. Just that in most cases no one has been on the end of them.


?!?!?!Not excellent if they're not finding our players surely?

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Sun Sep 16, 2007 9:49 pm

gray wrote:
Also I want more songs from Godfrey in the future, I reckon Minnie The Moocher would sound amazing etc etc etc


:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: Godfrey, Godfrey give us a song, Godfrey give us a song!


Image

Do you think I may be excused Mr Mainwaring? My sister Dolly needs help setting up her cake stall at the WI garden party.

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Sun Sep 16, 2007 9:51 pm

hay guys i'm not saying sonner is a world beater, just that if you put someone next to him to boss, win the ball, and genarally water carry, he can move, pass, create, and is allways available, he is one half of what a midfield needs, and yes he can loose the ball at times, and yes his touch is not perfect, but he never hides and i like that, and if he could do those things perfectly he would be nowhere near us,. put a high energy tough man next to him and we would match or better anything in this league i don't think we would have been so much in control of that game yesterday if it were not for him, and i do think he had a good no not great but good game.

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Mon Sep 17, 2007 10:37 am

Roper is well past his best. I know he's been at the club years (as with Wracky), but you have to take off the rose coloured specs and be honest. I can't comment on Saturday as I didn't go, but the Vale match was his best so far this season and he was decent at best (ie did what you'd expect from a centre half). My problem with him is that he is a liability waiting to happen- gives away free kicks in stupid areas time after time, gets turned too easily and gets out smarted by any striker with a bit of a brain. Favouritism goes out of the window and the facts are he's no better than he was ten years ago. My main gripe is that he isn't fit until Christmas, and for a professional thats a disgrace. Gerrard is a much better player who, if given confidence is excellent and could be a future captain. I also worry that a youngster like Dann, who will be better than either of them, will not learn alongside Ropes. He offers no guidance to younger players and if anything they have to lead him - if we do have a bad season and the defence gets nervous, Dann may lose his confidence.

Saying that, well done lads for Saturday. Its the best place possible to get your first win, and to come back after conceding a late goal showed bottle.

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kshammer
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Mon Sep 17, 2007 10:43 am

I'm torn on Sonner. Lets be honest.... he's not very good is he, but compared to Dobbo then I sympathise with him. When Dobbo plays, he has to do the running for two men, and like him or not, he will run all day. Without Dobbo though, his poorness is highlighted as the arguement fails about his willingness to run. With Gerrard, against Port Vale, he had another player running so his technique was shown up more and he basically just ran into everyone, gave the ball away and was terrible.

To summarise...
Do I think he's good.... obviously not - he's rubbish
Does he try hard.... yes
Is he better than Dobbo.... for the fact he runs about, yes
Would I prefer us to replace him... yes if Dobbo is also replaced
Is his hair ridiculous.... well durrrr!

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Mon Sep 17, 2007 10:48 am

kshammer wrote:Is his hair ridiculous.... well durrrr!


Definitely should get a sensible trim, like the fella in your avatar.

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Mon Sep 17, 2007 10:54 am

Actually watching the highlights of our game showed that Sonner started both moves that lead to the goals by retaining posession under-pressure then making a pass into an attacking area for Sonko and Wrack to fashion the goalscoring opportunity.

So good play all round, and evidence as I suggested that as a unit the midfield functioned very well on Saturday.

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Mon Sep 17, 2007 10:59 am

kshammer wrote:Roper is well past his best. I know he's been at the club years (as with Wracky), but you have to take off the rose coloured specs and be honest. I can't comment on Saturday as I didn't go, but the Vale match was his best so far this season and he was decent at best (ie did what you'd expect from a centre half). My problem with him is that he is a liability waiting to happen- gives away free kicks in stupid areas time after time, gets turned too easily and gets out smarted by any striker with a bit of a brain. Favouritism goes out of the window and the facts are he's no better than he was ten years ago. My main gripe is that he isn't fit until Christmas, and for a professional thats a disgrace. Gerrard is a much better player who, if given confidence is excellent and could be a future captain. I also worry that a youngster like Dann, who will be better than either of them, will not learn alongside Ropes. He offers no guidance to younger players and if anything they have to lead him - if we do have a bad season and the defence gets nervous, Dann may lose his confidence.

Saying that, well done lads for Saturday. Its the best place possible to get your first win, and to come back after conceding a late goal showed bottle.


I do agree with this (if not with much of the rest - Roper's much better than Gerrard when fit). And we've got to the stage now where it's almost considered acceptable by some fans for him to be off the pace a bit for the first few games of the season. It's not - it's totally unprofessional not to be in shape for the first game of the season (injuries excepted) and impacts on the rest of the team. Not only that, but it tends to be self-perpetuating. Roper often gets a red card in the first few games of the season, leading to another lay-off where he's at risk of piling on the pounds again.

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Mon Sep 17, 2007 11:13 am

Dont get me wrong kids, Im not saying the guy should never play for us again like im sure Daz and Phil think but I didnt think he had a good game at all, after the Vale game I thought he was very impressive.

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Mon Sep 17, 2007 11:26 am

kshammer wrote:Roper is well past his best. I know he's been at the club years (as with Wracky), but you have to take off the rose coloured specs and be honest. I can't comment on Saturday as I didn't go, but the Vale match was his best so far this season and he was decent at best (ie did what you'd expect from a centre half). My problem with him is that he is a liability waiting to happen- gives away free kicks in stupid areas time after time, gets turned too easily and gets out smarted by any striker with a bit of a brain. Favouritism goes out of the window and the facts are he's no better than he was ten years ago. My main gripe is that he isn't fit until Christmas, and for a professional thats a disgrace. Gerrard is a much better player who, if given confidence is excellent and could be a future captain. I also worry that a youngster like Dann, who will be better than either of them, will not learn alongside Ropes. He offers no guidance to younger players and if anything they have to lead him - if we do have a bad season and the defence gets nervous, Dann may lose his confidence.

Saying that, well done lads for Saturday. Its the best place possible to get your first win, and to come back after conceding a late goal showed bottle.


Strongly dissagree , Roper is still our best defender , Dann is finding his feet at this level , I don't know what Roper as to do to prove himself , at this or championship level . managers and fans have written him off before , but he always proves them wrong.
Yes he does start a new saeson slow , always has . some fans who travelled to Millwall had him down as MOTM , before his injury . i hope he's fit for Oldham.

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Mon Sep 17, 2007 11:28 am

DAVEDEAN wrote:
kshammer wrote:Roper is well past his best. I know he's been at the club years (as with Wracky), but you have to take off the rose coloured specs and be honest. I can't comment on Saturday as I didn't go, but the Vale match was his best so far this season and he was decent at best (ie did what you'd expect from a centre half). My problem with him is that he is a liability waiting to happen- gives away free kicks in stupid areas time after time, gets turned too easily and gets out smarted by any striker with a bit of a brain. Favouritism goes out of the window and the facts are he's no better than he was ten years ago. My main gripe is that he isn't fit until Christmas, and for a professional thats a disgrace. Gerrard is a much better player who, if given confidence is excellent and could be a future captain. I also worry that a youngster like Dann, who will be better than either of them, will not learn alongside Ropes. He offers no guidance to younger players and if anything they have to lead him - if we do have a bad season and the defence gets nervous, Dann may lose his confidence.

Saying that, well done lads for Saturday. Its the best place possible to get your first win, and to come back after conceding a late goal showed bottle.


Strongly dissagree , Roper is still our best defender , Dann is finding his feet at this level , I don't know what Roper as to do to prove himself , at this or championship level . managers and fans have written him off before , but he always proves them wrong.
Yes he does start a new saeson slow , always has . some fans who travelled to Millwall had him down as MOTM , before his injury . i hope he's fit for Oldham.


I hope he is fit too, but Antnee did a good job aswell so its not a huge drop in quality

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Mon Sep 17, 2007 11:39 am

Comedy Moment:

For the first goal, look out for the two Millwall defenders at the far post completely losing the ball after the keeper punches it up in the air.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=OfhAMV_Y1e0

:lol:

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Mon Sep 17, 2007 11:41 am

Gary Ellison Saddler wrote:
DAVEDEAN wrote:
kshammer wrote:Roper is well past his best. I know he's been at the club years (as with Wracky), but you have to take off the rose coloured specs and be honest. I can't comment on Saturday as I didn't go, but the Vale match was his best so far this season and he was decent at best (ie did what you'd expect from a centre half). My problem with him is that he is a liability waiting to happen- gives away free kicks in stupid areas time after time, gets turned too easily and gets out smarted by any striker with a bit of a brain. Favouritism goes out of the window and the facts are he's no better than he was ten years ago. My main gripe is that he isn't fit until Christmas, and for a professional thats a disgrace. Gerrard is a much better player who, if given confidence is excellent and could be a future captain. I also worry that a youngster like Dann, who will be better than either of them, will not learn alongside Ropes. He offers no guidance to younger players and if anything they have to lead him - if we do have a bad season and the defence gets nervous, Dann may lose his confidence.

Saying that, well done lads for Saturday. Its the best place possible to get your first win, and to come back after conceding a late goal showed bottle.


Strongly dissagree , Roper is still our best defender , Dann is finding his feet at this level , I don't know what Roper as to do to prove himself , at this or championship level . managers and fans have written him off before , but he always proves them wrong.
Yes he does start a new saeson slow , always has . some fans who travelled to Millwall had him down as MOTM , before his injury . i hope he's fit for Oldham.


I hope he is fit too, but Antnee did a good job aswell so its not a huge drop in quality


Agreed , I Think it was MMF who said before the season started that , Gerrard could improve playing at an higher level , I think he as .

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Mon Sep 17, 2007 11:46 am

DAVEDEAN wrote:...

DAVEDEAN wrote:...


WOW!

With my red and blue glasses on, that really does look like it comes out of the screen!

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Duke
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Mon Sep 17, 2007 11:58 am

double post :oops:

over to you mods. :D

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King Crimson
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Mon Sep 17, 2007 1:10 pm

Done Dave.

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Duke
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Mon Sep 17, 2007 1:12 pm

King Crimson wrote:Done Dave.


Your a star KC , Cheers.

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Mon Sep 17, 2007 1:22 pm

Just watched the highlights, Ince made a good save in the first, but hecould of been at fault for theirs, what was he doing, he was in no mans land.

Sonko with an assist and half an assist.

If fox hadnt of scored afterwards, id be slagging him off for that header, should of buried it! :twisted:

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kshammer
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Mon Sep 17, 2007 1:42 pm

To say Roper is our best defender really puzzles me. I know everyone has their own opinions and thats whats great about football, but some things are so obvious I wonder what peole see. Dann is superior to Roper in every way - even when Ropes is fit. He is a better header (ie they go out instead of up), tackler (he actually tackles rather than fouls), can pass (rather than hoof), can outsmart a forward (rather than panic), doesn't push people over, scores a few and is calm on the ball. Some argue Ropes does the basics well... he does.... then pushes someone over 25 yards from goal... then gets caught out of position.... then gets sent off.... then is too unfit to play.... and so on.

To accept Roper's lack of fitness because he always has been unfit is clap trap. He's professional and has been for many years. His conditioning should be spot on... if I had three months a year when I was crap at my job i'd get the boot.

If you want to watch footballers, pick Gerrard and Dann. If you want to watch glorified park players then start with Ropes

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Mon Sep 17, 2007 1:45 pm

kshammer wrote:To say Roper is our best defender really puzzles me. I know everyone has their own opinions and thats whats great about football, but some things are so obvious I wonder what peole see. Dann is superior to Roper in every way - even when Ropes is fit. He is a better header (ie they go out instead of up), tackler (he actually tackles rather than fouls), can pass (rather than hoof), can outsmart a forward (rather than panic), doesn't push people over, scores a few and is calm on the ball. Some argue Ropes does the basics well... he does.... then pushes someone over 25 yards from goal... then gets caught out of position.... then gets sent off.... then is too unfit to play.... and so on.

To accept Roper's lack of fitness because he always has been unfit is clap trap. He's professional and has been for many years. His conditioning should be spot on... if I had three months a year when I was crud at my job i'd get the boot.

If you want to watch footballers, pick Gerrard and Dann. If you want to watch glorified park players then start with Ropes


Dann is not better than Roper, I actually think Dann is slower than Roper too. However i do agree Roper is prone to the odd stupid foul, i.e against Swansea he neednt of hacked their striker down.

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Mon Sep 17, 2007 1:48 pm

Just saw the goals on Youtube... Deeney following in back post like all the great strikers! Great moment for him....

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Mon Sep 17, 2007 1:49 pm

kshammer wrote:To accept Roper's lack of fitness because he always has been unfit is clap trap. He's professional and has been for many years. His conditioning should be spot on... if I had three months a year when I was crud at my job i'd get the boot.


I agree whole-heartedly with that bit, and it was one of the very few things Merson actually got right when he questioned Roper's fitness.

That no manager has managed to get Roper firing on all cylinders at the start of the season means you can't question the manager, but only the player. I haven't a clue what he does over the summer, but for a professional footballer, he really shouldn't need as much time to get fit as he does. I also think this is the reason he picks up so many little niggling injuries as well, espeically in the past few years.

As for the rest of your point, footballers like Roper are needed at this level, they're just like brick walls. Yes, he gives away silly fouls, yes, he can be clumsy but he prevents a lot more chances than he concedes, that's without doubt in my mind.

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Mon Sep 17, 2007 1:50 pm

I'll shut up about Roper... we'll have to agree to disagree.......

Rant over.

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Mon Sep 17, 2007 2:10 pm

latviancheese wrote:
kshammer wrote:To say Roper is our best defender really puzzles me. I know everyone has their own opinions and thats whats great about football, but some things are so obvious I wonder what peole see. Dann is superior to Roper in every way - even when Ropes is fit. He is a better header (ie they go out instead of up), tackler (he actually tackles rather than fouls), can pass (rather than hoof), can outsmart a forward (rather than panic), doesn't push people over, scores a few and is calm on the ball. Some argue Ropes does the basics well... he does.... then pushes someone over 25 yards from goal... then gets caught out of position.... then gets sent off.... then is too unfit to play.... and so on.

To accept Roper's lack of fitness because he always has been unfit is clap trap. He's professional and has been for many years. His conditioning should be spot on... if I had three months a year when I was crud at my job i'd get the boot.

If you want to watch footballers, pick Gerrard and Dann. If you want to watch glorified park players then start with Ropes


Dann is not better than Roper, I actually think Dann is slower than Roper too. However i do agree Roper is prone to the odd stupid foul, i.e against Swansea he neednt of hacked their striker down.


And Wrack neednt have given the ball away , putting Ropes in an impossible position but thats another story.
I've no doubt Dann will be a far better player than Roper in years to come . but IMHO Roper is now our best defender , unless Picken (who) proves me wrong.

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Mon Sep 17, 2007 3:16 pm

DAVEDEAN wrote:
latviancheese wrote:
kshammer wrote:To say Roper is our best defender really puzzles me. I know everyone has their own opinions and thats whats great about football, but some things are so obvious I wonder what peole see. Dann is superior to Roper in every way - even when Ropes is fit. He is a better header (ie they go out instead of up), tackler (he actually tackles rather than fouls), can pass (rather than hoof), can outsmart a forward (rather than panic), doesn't push people over, scores a few and is calm on the ball. Some argue Ropes does the basics well... he does.... then pushes someone over 25 yards from goal... then gets caught out of position.... then gets sent off.... then is too unfit to play.... and so on.

To accept Roper's lack of fitness because he always has been unfit is clap trap. He's professional and has been for many years. His conditioning should be spot on... if I had three months a year when I was crud at my job i'd get the boot.

If you want to watch footballers, pick Gerrard and Dann. If you want to watch glorified park players then start with Ropes


Dann is not better than Roper, I actually think Dann is slower than Roper too. However i do agree Roper is prone to the odd stupid foul, i.e against Swansea he neednt of hacked their striker down.


And Wrack neednt have given the ball away , putting Ropes in an impossible position but thats another story.
I've no doubt Dann will be a far better player than Roper in years to come . but IMHO Roper is now our best defender , unless Picken (who) proves me wrong.



Yeah, Roper's better than Dann at the moment - but he should be: he's 30, Dann's 20. I don't think that there can be any argument (from anyone over the age of 20) that Dann is a much better player than Roper was ten years ago.

Both are better than Gerrard, who (although he has looked better this season) still lives off his family name. If he was called something else then there's no way that he'd be described as a ball-playing centre half - his distribution is only very marginally better than Roper's.

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Mon Sep 17, 2007 3:28 pm

Plastic Hawk wrote:
DAVEDEAN wrote:
latviancheese wrote:
kshammer wrote:To say Roper is our best defender really puzzles me. I know everyone has their own opinions and thats whats great about football, but some things are so obvious I wonder what peole see. Dann is superior to Roper in every way - even when Ropes is fit. He is a better header (ie they go out instead of up), tackler (he actually tackles rather than fouls), can pass (rather than hoof), can outsmart a forward (rather than panic), doesn't push people over, scores a few and is calm on the ball. Some argue Ropes does the basics well... he does.... then pushes someone over 25 yards from goal... then gets caught out of position.... then gets sent off.... then is too unfit to play.... and so on.

To accept Roper's lack of fitness because he always has been unfit is clap trap. He's professional and has been for many years. His conditioning should be spot on... if I had three months a year when I was crud at my job i'd get the boot.

If you want to watch footballers, pick Gerrard and Dann. If you want to watch glorified park players then start with Ropes


Dann is not better than Roper, I actually think Dann is slower than Roper too. However i do agree Roper is prone to the odd stupid foul, i.e against Swansea he neednt of hacked their striker down.


And Wrack neednt have given the ball away , putting Ropes in an impossible position but thats another story.
I've no doubt Dann will be a far better player than Roper in years to come . but IMHO Roper is now our best defender , unless Picken (who) proves me wrong.



Yeah, Roper's better than Dann at the moment - but he should be: he's 30, Dann's 20. I don't think that there can be any argument (from anyone over the age of 20) that Dann is a much better player than Roper was ten years ago.

Both are better than Gerrard, who (although he has looked better this season) still lives off his family name. If he was called something else then there's no way that he'd be described as a ball-playing centre half - his distribution is only very marginally better than Roper's.


I also have no doubt Dann will be better than Roper if he continues to improve.

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Mon Sep 17, 2007 5:03 pm

The goals are now on the Virgin website

http://www.football.virginmedia.com/pag ... 54,00.html


Just watched their equaliser.

Is that the reason Ishmel was taken off, allowing the Millwall player to cross like that ?
Not surprised if that is the case.

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