Port Vale (H) League One - Saturday 8th September, 1pm KO

[Plastic Hawk]

The fault of this is down to one person and one person only.

The manager.

That comment surprises me.
Seriously, what do you think Richard Money, as our manager, is doing wrong?

I can't think of much if I'm honest. All comes down to what he's got to work with if you ask me.

I really do believe he's doing the best he can with the people available. Now whether the people who are available to him are soley down to DD or down to somebody else is another question.

My thoughts exactly. If we look at DD's signings in terms of their order, he has always brought in experienced British players first before signing unknown foreigners to fill the squad out a bit. Without wanting to have a dig at Sonko, does anyone think he's have signed Hall if Sonko was the player he really wanted? That's just one example. I fail to see an argument in favour of Money being 100% responsible for bringing Carneiro, Junior and Sonko in and that is where I believe much of the problem lies.

I'm always suspicious of exactly who's signed players who have Portuguese as a first language. Now it could be just a coincidence that so many of our new signings come from the country in which our "football consultant" is building a second home, but you have to suspect that looking for players - any players - there is the easy option - and so much the better if his company also represents them...

[Cannock]

Then again Rob we have the likes of Geordie, Cederqvist, Picken who never set the world alight.

Then you can throw in the first teamers such as Dobson (sorry but i think he is limited), Sonner - as Dobson etc etc.


I am simply not convinced by his signing strategy.

This one is a general open question.

If DD doesn't have the final say in signing the players then who does.

I can't believe (maybe i'm naive) STM decides to sign players and then tells DD that's who he is going to work with.

I doubt DD would stand for that given his perceived stubborness.

[Salop Saddler]

Then again Rob we have the likes of Geordie, Cederqvist, Picken who never set the world alight.

Then you can throw in the first teamers such as Dobson (sorry but i think he is limited), Sonner - as Dobson etc etc.


I am simply not convinced by hi signing strategy.

This one is a general open question.

If DD doesn't have the final say in signing the players then who does.

I can't believe (maybe i'm naive) STM decides to sign players and then tells DD that's who he is going to work with.

I doubt DD would stand for that given his perceived stubborness.

It's a matter for the owner and STM I'd guess. They seem to have a close working relationship, and it's clear from quotes in the press that Bonser likes the way Tayor operates. It's a system they see fit to exercise at the club and one which will continue long into the future it seems.

As for DD not standing for it, well, like the rest of us he's got bills to pay, and he has to dance to someones tune. But he's well qualified on paper, and should it all get too much for him I'd imagine he'd slip into another role pretty quickly.

[dler]

Would DD have signed Joe Broad on a long term contract? Sadly, I believe he would. Recognising talent is not his strength.

[WFC_Rob]

This one is a general open question.

If DD doesn't have the final say in signing the players then who does.

I can't believe (maybe i'm naive) STM decides to sign players and then tells DD that's who he is going to work with.

I doubt DD would stand for that given his perceived stubborness.

To put this simply, I reckon Taylor gets these players in with Bonser's permission and we get them on a knock-down price. Money goes along with this because he realises he either signs them or signs no-one. Pure speculation on my part, but I'm struggling to see an alternative.
It almost seems as if we have one budget for Money's signings and a seperate one for Taylor's.

[Cannock]

You could well be right.

If that is the case it is further proof that the football in WS1 is secondary to other personal objectives and goals. Very distressing.

[Cannock]

Bloody hell Rob, you have depressed me further

[fensaddler]

We've played six games, and had a lot of chances in most of them. We've played good sides and poor sides. Given we will always have one or two out with injury etc, and this will be the norm in the winter months, we can hardly claim that we are having a bad run on injuries. We've had awful refs, and better ones. In total, I think we've seen enough now to know how good this side is, and I'm rapidly coming to the conclusion that we are in trouble here. If we cannot take apart a woeful Vale side at home, then we cannot expect to gather anything like the points we need to stay up, let alone look to mid table safety. Ifs and buts and maybes count for nothing - goals and points do. I've seen some promising football this season, and plenty of good chances - but everything I know about football, and everything I've seen tells me we will be back where we came from in May. Our opportunity to turn this round comes with the loan signings, because we need fresh blood in to change things and raise confidence. If this doesn't happen very quickly we will end up cut adrift with no confidence, a weak squad, and dwindling crowds, and that only heads one way - down, and this time with far less hope of another season like last one - I doubt we will have the energy to pick ourselves up again. I'm usually one of the optimists...

[WFC_Rob]

Bloody hell Rob, you have depressed me further

:lol:
Given that we started off with me arguing that things aren't as bad as they may seem on the pitch, I hadn't intended to put a negative slant on things. Unfortunately, this Paul Taylor/Jeff Bonser/Money/budget relationship is what has me frustrated more than anything at the moment.

[latviancheese]

Its simple really, we play like we did in the first half today, in the second half too! Eventually we will score.

[OldPenkSaddler]

Slightly better performance overall and perhaps unlucky not to win.

Watched the pre-match warm up. Whitley had them running (slowly) around the markers in a square. Those right behind him were Roper and Dann and the two idle boys right at the back were Hall and Sonner. That says a lot to me about how committed they are and how much they want to set an example to the younger players. If they were conserving their energy for the game, it didn't show.

Good to see Fox and Gerrard actually get in front of the strikers a couple of times. This never happens with Dobson and Sonner and is part of our problem.

Odd substitutions. Hall should have been off at half time and Fox was unlucky to come off.

Vale were a poor team ( although I wouldn't mind swapping Sonner with their Rocastle) who we should have beaten easily. Good chance we'll be bottom after next weeks game but lets hope that DD can get in a couple of loan signings before then. He was hopeful of this in his WM interview.

[Plastic Hawk]

Its simple really, we play like we did in the first half today, in the second half too! Eventually we will score.

Yeah, but not often enough... :cry:

[Greg WP]

Good point there about dwindling crowds. The last two home turnouts have totalled 8300, the lowest for 2 consecutive home games in ten yrs by my reckoning. Our support is dropping lke a stone. It seasy to start blaming the apathy of Walsall people but fact is we have lost about 1400 fans since the Carlisle game. Sub 4000 gates beckon giving Money all the excuses he needs.

[Whitti Steve]

Once again - negativity reigns I see. Yesterday was a good game, we played well and created chances. The only problem with yesterday was the inability to put the ball in the net. We had a vital decision go against us too. I too am concerned about where the first win is coming from, but some of you already have us back in League 2. If you think yesterday was a poor game - why were the team applauded off by the vast majority of the crowd at the end of both halves?

It is obvious to anyone that we need a striker who can find the net, but surely we should be looking for the positives after a much improved performance, not getting ready for a trip to League 2!

[Fray Bentos is God!]

Once again - negativity reigns I see. Yesterday was a good game, we played well and created chances. The only problem with yesterday was the inability to put the ball in the net. We had a vital decision go against us too. I too am concerned about where the first win is coming from, but some of you already have us back in League 2. If you think yesterday was a poor game - why were the team applauded off by the vast majority of the crowd at the end of both halves?

It is obvious to anyone that we need a striker who can find the net, but surely we should be looking for the positives after a much improved performance, not getting ready for a trip to League 2!

Well said Stevie poo

[Duke]

Didn't go yesterday listened on the radio . I found a bit of encouragement from the performance , certainly much improved from Bournemouth .
Obviously missing chances cost us , WM were convinced we should have had a penalty .
What really impressed me was the attitude of the players was spot on , that bodes well for the next few games .
DD said after the game 2 news faces could be here for next week , and he hoping Sonko returns from international duty injury free .
We need that first win to build confidence , and bit of luck wouldn't go amiss. I honestly believe we're not to far away.

UP THE SADDLERS

[Jolly Johnny]

Once again - negativity reigns I see. Yesterday was a good game, we played well and created chances. The only problem with yesterday was the inability to put the ball in the net. We had a vital decision go against us too. I too am concerned about where the first win is coming from, but some of you already have us back in League 2. If you think yesterday was a poor game - why were the team applauded off by the vast majority of the crowd at the end of both halves?

It is obvious to anyone that we need a striker who can find the net, but surely we should be looking for the positives after a much improved performance, not getting ready for a trip to League 2!

Another sensible head! Are you fishing for a moderators berth?!!! :wink:

[Ned_Kelly]

The fault of this is down to one person and one person only.

The manager.

That comment surprises me.
Seriously, what do you think Richard Money, as our manager, is doing wrong?

I can't think of much if I'm honest. All comes down to what he's got to work with if you ask me.

Took Fox off when he was playing well. Took Sonner off who was having a good game. Got Deeney to get changed ready to come on then told him to take his top off again and sent Alex on. Does he really know what he's doing or does he have bits of paper in his pocket with ideas on and picks 1 out at ramdom :?

[Bernie]

Walsall has been relegated 3 times in the last 7 seven years.

This happened in 2000, 2004 and 2006.

Our recent experience of relegation is bound to cause us to worry.

Everyone who has posted about their worries knows that no side has ever been relegated in September. They remember that in 2000 and 2004 our fate was not decided until the very last match of the season. Even in 2006 we still had hope until the 43rd match of the season. They know that it is possible that we will quickly pull clear of the relegation battle, but even if we do not we will have plenty of chances to do so until April next year.

Nobody is saying that we are certain to go down, they know we have 41 matches left and that everything is still possible for the season ahead.

But that does not stop them looking at the results we have had in the first seven matches this season and comparing them to the starts made in the seasons when we were relegated. It does not stop them looking at the squad we have and trying to work out if it is going to be good enough to beat many teams. That is not defeatism, just realism.

[Purple Toucan Saddler]

The fault of this is down to one person and one person only.

The manager.

That comment surprises me.
Seriously, what do you think Richard Money, as our manager, is doing wrong?

I can't think of much if I'm honest. All comes down to what he's got to work with if you ask me.

Took Fox off when he was playing well. Took Sonner off who was having a good game. Got Deeney to get changed ready to come on then told him to take his top off again and sent Alex on. Does he really know what he's doing or does he have bits of paper in his pocket with ideas on and picks 1 out at ramdom :?

May be in the first half, but his form dropped right off in the second.

Least your prediction was incorrect on the scoreline :lol:

[Ned_Kelly]

The fault of this is down to one person and one person only.

The manager.

That comment surprises me.
Seriously, what do you think Richard Money, as our manager, is doing wrong?

I can't think of much if I'm honest. All comes down to what he's got to work with if you ask me.

Took Fox off when he was playing well. Took Sonner off who was having a good game. Got Deeney to get changed ready to come on then told him to take his top off again and sent Alex on. Does he really know what he's doing or does he have bits of paper in his pocket with ideas on and picks 1 out at ramdom :?

May be in the first half, but his form dropped right off in the second.

Least your prediction was incorrect on the scoreline :lol:

I was halfway right. I had us down for nil :wink: :D

[Bristol Fan]

We created enough chances, but couldn't put them away - our forward line just isn't good enough. That we still have to play Anthony Gerrard in midfield because one first team midfielder is injured is a big worry also. Quite why Demontagnac isn't starting "in the hole" instead of Hall is an absolute mystery, he was sensational there in the last home game. Worrying times.

[latviancheese]

I dont think ive ever seen as blatent and obvious handball in my life. we had two one on ones with the goalkeeper and we didnt score which says everything about yesterday if you ask me.

[Stu]

I have to say I'm surprised at folk who said there were encouraging signs yesterday. The match, on the whole, was not very different to how the season has gone to date anyway. We played quite well, we created chances, we made a few defensive slips. The only difference was Vale were such a poor side that they didn't take advantage of the chances they had, very much like us. But make no mistake, anyone who thinks that yesterday was 1 point gained instead of 2 points dropped is deluded to be frank.

Yesterday was clearly 2 points dropped. We played okay, a 6/10 performance, we didn't play poorly but we didn't play good and ultimately we weren't good enough to win the match as the final score says it was 0-0. There is no point pointing to a stinking referreeing decision, as we have no idea what other impact that would have had on the match to be honest. And there were still 89 other minutes in which we had the opportunity to score a goal.

The substitutions surprised me, Nicholls looked nowhere near ready, Diddy ran around a lot but didn't really make an impact but it was good to see energy and pace in our midfield, Ishy didn't seem to get involved yesterday. Paul Hall was diabolical, being polite, but is being played out of position and it shows.

The one positive was a clean sheet, but conversly Vale had 2/3 good chances to score yesterday, once again Scott Dann was caught in possession trying to dribble out of defence and take a player on. So I think the clean sheet was more down to the lack of threat from Vale, as we didn't appear to have tightened up much individually.

I said pre-season that we didn't have goals in this team, only to be told that Mooney/Butler/Hall would all contribute double figures, I've seen nowt so far to show me that Butler/Hall will hit double figures this season at the rate they're going at.

How many times are we going to say "Played okay but failed to take chances" or "Played okay but made mistakes".

It was good to hear DD saying he hoped to have 1 or 2 new faces in, personally I'd like a centre half, centre midfielder and striker.

We're okay, but we're just not good enough as things stand.

[Cueball]

I have to say I'm surprised at folk who said there were encouraging signs yesterday. The match, on the whole, was not very different to how the season has gone to date anyway. We played quite well, we created chances, we made a few defensive slips. The only difference was Vale were such a poor side that they didn't take advantage of the chances they had, very much like us. But make no mistake, anyone who thinks that yesterday was 1 point gained instead of 2 points dropped is deluded to be frank.

Yesterday was clearly 2 points dropped. We played okay, a 6/10 performance, we didn't play poorly but we didn't play good and ultimately we weren't good enough to win the match as the final score says it was 0-0. There is no point pointing to a stinking referreeing decision, as we have no idea what other impact that would have had on the match to be honest. And there were still 89 other minutes in which we had the opportunity to score a goal.

The substitutions surprised me, Nicholls looked nowhere near ready, Diddy ran around a lot but didn't really make an impact but it was good to see energy and pace in our midfield, Ishy didn't seem to get involved yesterday. Paul Hall was diabolical, being polite, but is being played out of position and it shows.

The one positive was a clean sheet, but conversly Vale had 2/3 good chances to score yesterday, once again Scott Dann was caught in possession trying to dribble out of defence and take a player on. So I think the clean sheet was more down to the lack of threat from Vale, as we didn't appear to have tightened up much individually.

I said pre-season that we didn't have goals in this team, only to be told that Mooney/Butler/Hall would all contribute double figures, I've seen nowt so far to show me that Butler/Hall will hit double figures this season at the rate they're going at.

How many times are we going to say "Played okay but failed to take chances" or "Played okay but made mistakes".

It was good to hear DD saying he hoped to have 1 or 2 new faces in, personally I'd like a centre half, centre midfielder and striker.

We're okay, but we're just not good enough as things stand.

100% agree. It is very worrying that home wins are becoming as elusive as away victories. I really haven't got faith that we'll beat anyone at the moment. I can't imagine that there are too many worse teams than Vale in this division. I'm also not sure that 1 loan signing is going to be enough, I feel DD needs to do a Merson and get at least 3 players in on loan.

Oh well, I suppose things can only get better...

[tape66]

Yesterday was the first game I really enjoyed this season and after the performance the lads put in I feel more encouraged for the season ahead. DD seamed to have ironed out the defensive errors and again we created loads of chances. A game we should have won.
Now we need to convert these chances to goals and we will be well on our way.

Bring on Millwall.

[Geordiesaddler]

To me the most alarming thing about this slump, unlike the one we experienced last season is that we are playing teams who you would love to play on current form. Gilllingham hadn't won a match and were awful, Vale are a team we could have leapfrogged, Bournemouth hadn't scored a goal at home, Swansea - despite whet's been said about them havn't beaten anyone apart from us and have lost to fellow srugglers Doncaster and Oldham, and failed to beat Forest.

On the positive side, either Carlisle or Orient impressed me much, in fact Orient didn't impress me at all.

So I really think this is a division that from top to bottom is much of a muchness, albeit a higher standard than last season.

Its worrying that we are consistently falling short because we havn't got the quality, but I reckon a small improvement will bring results (if that makes sense), that improvement certainly needs to be the introduction of a striker to cover Mooney's absence, but I still think Sonko will add some much needed quality and creativity from what I saw of him last week.

Going back to my first point, there will never be a better time to visit Millwall!! they are on the crest of a slump, can't score goals, and have two players suspended I believe nest week. Let's get some players in to pep things up and go for it.

[Whitti Steve]

To me the most alarming thing about this slump, unlike the one we experienced last season is that we are playing teams who you would love to play on current form. Gilllingham hadn't won a match and were awful, Vale are a team we could have leapfrogged, Bournemouth hadn't scored a goal at home, Swansea - despite whet's been said about them havn't beaten anyone apart from us and have lost to fellow srugglers Doncaster and Oldham, and failed to beat Forest.

On the positive side, either Carlisle or Orient impressed me much, in fact Orient didn't impress me at all.

So I really think this is a division that from top to bottom is much of a muchness, albeit a higher standard than last season.

Its worrying that we are consistently falling short because we havn't got the quality, but I reckon a small improvement will bring results (if that makes sense), that improvement certainly needs to be the introduction of a striker to cover Mooney's absence, but I still think Sonko will add some much needed quality and creativity from what I saw of him last week.

Going back to my first point, there will never be a better time to visit Millwall!! they are on the crest of a slump, can't score goals, and have two players suspended I believe nest week. Let's get some players in to pep things up and go for it.

True - but there is NEVER a good time to visit Millwall :lol: Which pub is everyone going in near the ground :lol:

[YGA Saddler]

I worry about the amount of people on this thread that are clutching at straws by thinking once Mooney and Butler start a game together everything will be ok :roll: :oops: :?

[Whitti Steve]

I worry about the amount of people on this thread that are clutching at straws by thinking once Mooney and Butler start a game together everything will be ok :roll: :oops: :?

Dont worry about us happy clappers - concentrate on worrying about the team as a whole with the other doom-mongers :wink: :lol: