Bournemouth (A) J P Trophy 1st Round Tuesday 4/9/07.

[YGA Saddler]

The fact is, the clubs with positive fans who back their teams produce better results.......FACT. Not happy clappers but people who support their team.

You're a fairly knowledgeable poster MMF but occasionally you come out with some right pap. So Man Utd fans are well known for their positive, always-happy outlook are they?

This is not the same set of fans that Keane once lambasted as being prawn sandwich munchers who went deathly quiet if they hadn't scored after 20 minutes was it?

You can only clap, support and get behind a team that a) give 110% and b) win matches. Neither of which I have seen this season.

[Magic Man Fan]

The fact is, the clubs with positive fans who back their teams produce better results.......FACT. Not happy clappers but people who support their team.

You're a fairly knowledgeable poster MMF but occasionally you come out with some right pap. So Man Utd fans are well known for their positive, always-happy outlook are they?

This is not the same set of fans that Keane once lambasted as being prawn sandwich munchers who went deathly quiet if they hadn't scored after 20 minutes was it?

Have you been to Old Trafford? Every time I've been I've heard lots of vocal support and certainly never any chants anti their own players, manager or board which is what some are suggesting we do.

There's a difference between being quiet and chanting against your own club.

I'm sure you have been in which case this post is pointless. Then again you could just make it up, like about how bad our performances have been even though after losing at Leyton Orient and Gillingham the vast majority of people there clapped the players off because they saw promising signs.

[futuresobright]

The sustainability of the happy clappers' crush on Mr Touchy continues to surprise me. Quite rightly other managers who have failed to have us challenging for automatic promotion / play-offs in this division have been criticised. PM got some stick for only getting us to 14th in the league. But if Mr T can keep us up they think he's legend. Can't see the attraction myself.

[tinned]

Similarly, what about the money earned from a promotion won by a 20-goal striker? Of course, I don't expect us to spend big given our previous record, but he's more of an idiot than people have often suggested if he thinks it's impossible to make money by paying for players.

Right. Could you provide me with a list of players that we could sign and compete with other clubs for wages and transfer fees that will guarantee 20 goals and a promotion?

No. It is impossible.

We spoke to lots of strikers capable of scoring that many goals. Clubs with bigger fanbases and higher ticket prices offered bigger wages. Simple economics.

So..just to be fair mark, your saying there is no one out there we could have signed to score 20 goals a season? and the only economically viable outcome was to sign....the dreaded canary?

I'm not saying that at all. I'm saying NO-ONE can guarantee 20 goals a season.

Blame Money for the signings he's made. For the final time, there's money there waiting. He is the one who said all last week I want to give the players I've got a chance first. DD, not Bonser.

That's been my point for ages. Whatever funds Bonser has released, and whether that is sufficient, is another argument. You ain't gonna change that in the near future.

What my gripe is, whatever DD has been given has been mis-used (IMO).

[Neuromantic]

tbh, i think thats a bit of PR work he has done for Bonser. I find it hard to believe we have this money available. Its probably like a tenner or something.

I agree about no one guaranteeing 20 goals a season, however there are player much more likely than others to score 20 goals a season.

would you go for A canary or Jo Kuffour, Delboy Facey, Adam Boyd etc etc or several good young reserve premiership or championship strikers???

[Magic Man Fan]

tbh, i think thats a bit of PR work he has done for Bonser. I find it hard to believe we have this money available. Its probably like a tenner or something.

I agree about no one guaranteeing 20 goals a season, however there are player much more likely than others to score 20 goals a season.

would you go for A canary or Jo Kuffour, Delboy Facey, Adam Boyd etc etc or several good young reserve premiership or championship strikers???

The young Championship strikers are the only realistic ones.

I'm disappointed we don't get the likes of Adam Chambers, Proudlock, Shane Nicholson that leave bigger local clubs that would should have good links with to snap these players up before anyone else does.

[YGA Saddler]

tbh, i think thats a bit of PR work he has done for Bonser. I find it hard to believe we have this money available. Its probably like a tenner or something.

I agree about no one guaranteeing 20 goals a season, however there are player much more likely than others to score 20 goals a season.

would you go for A canary or Jo Kuffour, Delboy Facey, Adam Boyd etc etc or several good young reserve premiership or championship strikers???

The young Championship strikers are the only realistic ones.

I'm disappointed we don't get the likes of Adam Chambers, Proudlock, Shane Nicholson that leave bigger local clubs that would should have good links with to snap these players up before anyone else does.

He was on trial, had a YGA fat white belly and just couldnt cut it.

[Neuromantic]

I put it to you and everyone else then mark, that we dont go for these good young strikers like the Nicholsons et al of this world, because a random foreigner from some STM land, is cheaper. Bottom line. were not interested in spending the bit extra that could change our season, we sign random foreigners because its ............

I am honestly shocked that we didnt get any good forwards in.

[Plastic Hawk]

Jack Lester
Spencer Weir Daley
Ian Moore

There's three we could have easily got if the club had taken a chance. A three year contract to Lester would have been more reasonable than a year contract to Canary and Sonko.

Easily? As someone said earlier, do you live in cloud-cuckoo land?

Lester we could have got "easily" on a three year contract. At his age and with his injury record I'm not sure I'd have wanted to take that gamble for big wages. Could we have got him "easily" on a sensible contract? I doubt it - especially as he in fact moved to a club who were prepared to offer him that length of contract. In any case, he only scores at a goal every 5 1.2 games. He's a second striker, not a goalscorer. Is that the kind of player we're looking for?

Weir-Daley's rubbish. Look us his goals per game ratio some time. The fact that he's scored most of his goals against Walsall has warped some people's view of him. For what it's worth, I'm sure we could have got him "easily" - and would no doubt be regretting it now.

No way could we have got Moore "easily". He moved to Hartlepool. That's only down the road from Leeds, so probably didn't involve moving house, uprooting the kids etc. That'd have given them an edge over us even before we think about wages and the like - Hartlepool have shown that they're willing to push the boat out to sign a striker (Humphries last season). Whether or not you think we should do that too, it wouldn't be "easy" if we did.

In any case, there's no point crying over spilt milk. All of those players moved in the summer. We need to identify someone we can get in now.

[S.MURPHY]

plastic hawk

hartlepool signed barker from mansfield not humphreys.

but other than that your spot on. what i dont agree with is the comments made by dd and jb that we would have a strikeforce to die for and to wait and see who was coming.
i personally feel let down with the players bought in , i expected the club to build on last seasons success but at the moment it seems that last year could be wasted

[WFC_Rob]

Similarly, what about the money earned from a promotion won by a 20-goal striker? Of course, I don't expect us to spend big given our previous record, but he's more of an idiot than people have often suggested if he thinks it's impossible to make money by paying for players.

Right. Could you provide me with a list of players that we could sign and compete with other clubs for wages and transfer fees that will guarantee 20 goals and a promotion?

No. It is impossible.

We spoke to lots of strikers capable of scoring that many goals. Clubs with bigger fanbases and higher ticket prices offered bigger wages. Simple economics.

Bee in your bonnet?
I'm not saying there are any strikers who can guarantee 20 goals, but there are many with at least half a chance, which is more than can be said for our current lot.
The fact that the best we got was a Z-list Portuguese nobody shows that we're not paying enough.
I don't want us to end up as another Leeds, but that's looking at extremes. Seeing Colchester with such a small fanbase and nothing in terms of off the pitch money-making sign decent players makes me feel agitated to say the least.

My point was used to highlight our chairman's completely negative, selfish and defeatist attititude. He then wornders why we've been known not to remain positive when the chips are down.

[tinned]

what i dont agree with is the comments made by dd and jb that we would have a strikeforce to die for and to wait and see who was coming.

That's what rankles with a lot of fans. Did we miss something? Or were we supposed to get all excited about Canary, Mooney & Sonko?

[S.MURPHY]

i think the players we landed up with must have 14th or 15th choice.

[Magic Man Fan]

Similarly, what about the money earned from a promotion won by a 20-goal striker? Of course, I don't expect us to spend big given our previous record, but he's more of an idiot than people have often suggested if he thinks it's impossible to make money by paying for players.

Right. Could you provide me with a list of players that we could sign and compete with other clubs for wages and transfer fees that will guarantee 20 goals and a promotion?

No. It is impossible.

We spoke to lots of strikers capable of scoring that many goals. Clubs with bigger fanbases and higher ticket prices offered bigger wages. Simple economics.

Bee in your bonnet?
I'm not saying there are any strikers who can guarantee 20 goals, but there are many with at least half a chance, which is more than can be said for our current lot.
The fact that the best we got was a Z-list Portuguese nobody shows that we're not paying enough.
I don't want us to end up as another Leeds, but that's looking at extremes. Seeing Colchester with such a small fanbase and nothing in terms of off the pitch money-making sign decent players makes me feel agitated to say the least.

Then compare us like for like.

We were spending as much as, if not more than Colchester when we were also at that level. People just don't have a grasp on how much we overspent trying to stay in that division, we were paying several players big wages...we are still in debt and paying for it now which is why he have to be prudent until that debt is paid off. Again, simple economics.

[latviancheese]

what i dont agree with is the comments made by dd and jb that we would have a strikeforce to die for and to wait and see who was coming.

That's what rankles with a lot of fans. Did we miss something? Or were we supposed to get all excited about Canary, Mooney & Sonko?

I was excited by mooney, and Sonko has played for some big clubs.

[Magic Man Fan]

what i dont agree with is the comments made by dd and jb that we would have a strikeforce to die for and to wait and see who was coming.

That's what rankles with a lot of fans. Did we miss something? Or were we supposed to get all excited about Canary, Mooney & Sonko?

I was excited by mooney, and Sonko has played for some big clubs.

And looked promising again when he came on at Gillingham.

[SheffieldSaddler]

Jack Lester
Spencer Weir Daley
Ian Moore

There's three we could have easily got if the club had taken a chance. A three year contract to Lester would have been more reasonable than a year contract to Canary and Sonko.

Ian Moore - 40 goals in 7 years, yeah right! :roll:
Spencer Weir - Still young and a lot to prove.
Lester - Yes, we should have gone for.

[Magic Man Fan]

Jack Lester
Spencer Weir Daley
Ian Moore

There's three we could have easily got if the club had taken a chance. A three year contract to Lester would have been more reasonable than a year contract to Canary and Sonko.

Ian Moore - 40 goals in 7 years, yeah right! :roll:
Spencer Weir - Still young and a lot to prove.
Lester - Yes, we should have gone for.

We did but he is way too injury prone to offer a 3 year contract to which we would have had to have done to get his signature.

Like I say let's see how many games he plays over the 3 year period. I'm sure the club made the right decision in not matching the 3 year deal.

[SheffieldSaddler]

Jack Lester
Spencer Weir Daley
Ian Moore

There's three we could have easily got if the club had taken a chance. A three year contract to Lester would have been more reasonable than a year contract to Canary and Sonko.

Ian Moore - 40 goals in 7 years, yeah right! :roll:
Spencer Weir - Still young and a lot to prove.
Lester - Yes, we should have gone for.

We did but he is way too injury prone to offer a 3 year contract to which we would have had to have done to get his signature.

Like I say let's see how many games he plays over the 3 year period. I'm sure the club made the right decision in not matching the 3 year deal.

So in that case you wouldnt sign Michael Owen then? :roll:

[Magic Man Fan]

Jack Lester
Spencer Weir Daley
Ian Moore

There's three we could have easily got if the club had taken a chance. A three year contract to Lester would have been more reasonable than a year contract to Canary and Sonko.

Ian Moore - 40 goals in 7 years, yeah right! :roll:
Spencer Weir - Still young and a lot to prove.
Lester - Yes, we should have gone for.

We did but he is way too injury prone to offer a 3 year contract to which we would have had to have done to get his signature.

Like I say let's see how many games he plays over the 3 year period. I'm sure the club made the right decision in not matching the 3 year deal.

So in that case you wouldnt sign Michael Owen then? :roll:

If I was a Premiership manager with more money than brain cells then yes. If I was a manager with a strict budget and had to sign players that I'm likely to get my money's worth then no. I'd rather sign Andy Johnson or Robbie Keane or a few other strikers before Owen for the same or probably less money.

[Asps]

As fans we have faced crisis in our club's history, as with the Wheldon ground move, the collapse of the Ramsden era and at these times we all pulled together & become stronger by rejecting the easy way out.

At these times, our greatness as a fans has been our capacity to do what had to be done when we knew our course was right.

This is not a crisis, it's a minor set back: rally, be calm, prepare your support for Saturday's battle. That is all we can do.

[bleached blonde saddler]

Similarly, what about the money earned from a promotion won by a 20-goal striker? Of course, I don't expect us to spend big given our previous record, but he's more of an idiot than people have often suggested if he thinks it's impossible to make money by paying for players.

Right. Could you provide me with a list of players that we could sign and compete with other clubs for wages and transfer fees that will guarantee 20 goals and a promotion?

No. It is impossible.

We spoke to lots of strikers capable of scoring that many goals. Clubs with bigger fanbases and higher ticket prices offered bigger wages. Simple economics.

.
The fact that the best we got was a Z-list Portuguese nobody shows that we're not paying enough.

R u actually agreeing now that he isnt good enough WFC Rob ? it wasnt that long ago when you were slagging someone off for saying that he was no good !!

[Exile]

As fans we have faced crisis in our club's history, as with the Wheldon ground move, the collapse of the Ramsden era and at these times we all pulled together & become stronger by rejecting the easy way out.

At these times, our greatness as a fans has been our capacity to do what had to be done when we knew our course was right.

This is not a crisis, it's a minor set back: rally, be calm, prepare your support for Saturday's battle. That is all we can do.

Wise words.

[Neil Ravenscroft]

Jack Lester
Spencer Weir Daley
Ian Moore

There's three we could have easily got if the club had taken a chance. A three year contract to Lester would have been more reasonable than a year contract to Canary and Sonko.

Ian Moore - 40 goals in 7 years, yeah right! :roll:
Spencer Weir - Still young and a lot to prove.
Lester - Yes, we should have gone for.

We did but he is way too injury prone to offer a 3 year contract to which we would have had to have done to get his signature.

Like I say let's see how many games he plays over the 3 year period. I'm sure the club made the right decision in not matching the 3 year deal.

Ah, the "Spencer Weir Daly" thing again. A striker that good he's made ONE appearance for a fourth division club this season and come on twice as a sub. The man keeping him out of the side? The same Hector Sam loads of people said wasn't good enough for us last year. Hhmmmm.

[larryhaggler]

Hector Sam was not good enough, but compared to Canfairyo he a world beater.

[sack]

So DD says we where awful/not good enough/won't win any thing playing like that. Well isn't that what we have been saying for 4 weeks. I presume all the clappers are going to have a right go now, come on lads where's the thread calling DD a trofing pig/idiot/doom and gloom mergent. Or is it OK to have a opinion now mister money says you can. go on your allowed now fill your boats, or just keep right on dreaming boys. No midfielders in, no chance.

[Plastic Hawk]

So DD says we where awful/not good enough/won't win any thing playing like that. Well isn't that what we have been saying for 4 weeks. I presume all the clappers are going to have a right go now, come on lads where's the thread calling DD a trofing pig/idiot/doom and gloom mergent. Or is it OK to have a opinion now mister money says you can. go on your allowed now fill your boats, or just keep right on dreaming boys. No midfielders in, no chance.

I'm assuming that DD didn't say that we'd definitely get relegated? Or am I wrong?

[Stu]

Jack Lester
Spencer Weir Daley
Ian Moore

There's three we could have easily got if the club had taken a chance. A three year contract to Lester would have been more reasonable than a year contract to Canary and Sonko.

Ian Moore - 40 goals in 7 years, yeah right! :roll:
Spencer Weir - Still young and a lot to prove.
Lester - Yes, we should have gone for.

We did but he is way too injury prone to offer a 3 year contract to which we would have had to have done to get his signature.

Like I say let's see how many games he plays over the 3 year period. I'm sure the club made the right decision in not matching the 3 year deal.

Ah, the "Spencer Weir Daly" thing again. A striker that good he's made ONE appearance for a fourth division club this season and come on twice as a sub. The man keeping him out of the side? The same Hector Sam loads of people said wasn't good enough for us last year. Hhmmmm.

In all fairness, the lad did pick up an injury in pre-season that kept him out for at least a couple of weeks, so he will still be playing catch up on that, then consider he has to fight to get his place back.

So those 'stats' aren't really as clear cut as you make out to be honest. I still think he'd have been worth a gamble on paper, as his goals to game ratio is impressive, but as has been hinted before he might not have the attitude needed.

[Plastic Hawk]

Jack Lester
Spencer Weir Daley
Ian Moore

There's three we could have easily got if the club had taken a chance. A three year contract to Lester would have been more reasonable than a year contract to Canary and Sonko.

Ian Moore - 40 goals in 7 years, yeah right! :roll:
Spencer Weir - Still young and a lot to prove.
Lester - Yes, we should have gone for.

We did but he is way too injury prone to offer a 3 year contract to which we would have had to have done to get his signature.

Like I say let's see how many games he plays over the 3 year period. I'm sure the club made the right decision in not matching the 3 year deal.

Ah, the "Spencer Weir Daly" thing again. A striker that good he's made ONE appearance for a fourth division club this season and come on twice as a sub. The man keeping him out of the side? The same Hector Sam loads of people said wasn't good enough for us last year. Hhmmmm.

In all fairness, the lad did pick up an injury in pre-season that kept him out for at least a couple of weeks, so he will still be playing catch up on that, then consider he has to fight to get his place back.

So those 'stats' aren't really as clear cut as you make out to be honest. I still think he'd have been worth a gamble on paper, as his goals to game ratio is impressive, but as has been hinted before he might not have the attitude needed.

Well, yes and no. It's just over 1 in 4, which isn't that impressive. But most of his appearances are as sub so I guess it's really closer to 1 in 2, 1 in 3, which would be more impressive. But all but one of his (nine) goals have been scored in League 2. What would also worry me is that he's 22 (today in fact - Happy Birthday Spencer) and has only played 33 league games. That suggests that he's injured a lot - another reason to think twice about signing him.

[Stu]

Well, yes and no. It's just over 1 in 4, which isn't that impressive. But most of his appearances are as sub so I guess it's really closer to 1 in 2, 1 in 3, which would be more impressive. But all but one of his (nine) goals have been scored in League 2. What would also worry me is that he's 22 (today in fact - Happy Birthday Spencer) and has only played 33 league games. That suggests that he's injured a lot - another reason to think twice about signing him.

Or has just spent too long sitting on his backside in the hope of getting a game at Forest, before eventually giving up. As you say, there are concerns. He wouldn't have been my first choice by a long shot, but he'd have offered more than the Canary has as I do believe it was that sort of quick nippy player that could offer us the added dimension of pace and movement up front.

That's the benefit of hindsight I guess though to be honest. I see no point in rambling on about it now as its too late, its now a question of what we can do from here as we've not invented time machines as far as I'm aware.