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Lincoln (H)- League, Friday 16th February

Reports and reaction from the 2006-07 season as Walsall finished 1st (C) in League 2
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Barren Flak
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Fri Feb 16, 2007 11:20 pm

philthesaddler wrote:I know max, just highlighting how fickle the attitudes of some people are. one minute it's the performance that matters, the next its the result.

The bottom line [this bit is for cal] is that both matter ... If you're playing well and not getting results you arent unlucky, you're just not playing well enough, if you are playing badly and getting results then you're very lucky. The performance needs to be in place, then the results will come.

Tonight, how people can say that was a good performance is beyond me, we played at home, against a side missing their top scorer, and they embarassed us with some good moves, and matched us everywhere on the park, in fact bettering us in many areas. How is that a good performance?


I didn't say it was a good performance, I said it was a better performance than our two most recent home games.

Football for me is about mistakes and chances, at this level of football I'd say most goals come from defensive errors and set pieces, we need to cut ours out and make more from the opportunities we are given.

We've been poor at set pieces in the games we have drawn or lost recently, I think that is the main difference at the minute regardless of overall performance.

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Duke
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Fri Feb 16, 2007 11:24 pm

how can peiple say it was a poor performance :roll:

it was much better than of late .

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Fri Feb 16, 2007 11:28 pm

London Saddler wrote:Terrific atmosphere. Well done to the fans who were superb. But unfortunately another poor performance and another dreadful result. And again the opposition looked very comfortable. Difficult to say how good Lincoln were as currently we are making most teams look good

Wrong team selection to start with. Those who have seen us last season know Ropes and Westwood in centrral defence does not work. It didn't work today. When Westwood has been great at right back this season and Dann commanding at centre half, why was Dann dropped? Also bizarre 2nd and 3rd substitutions. Wrack on for Taylor? Wrack who in his last home appearance made Wright look like Ronaldinho was bought onto the left wing. Offered nothing tonight going forward or defensively. And Sam (one of our best players tonight) off and Cederquist on (did nothing again)

The goals we conceded were simple and down to Dobson. Both times, under no pressure, he stood there wondering what to do, was easily dispossed, and 2-3 passes later each time the ball was in the back of the net

Defensively we were shambles in the 1st half and unable to cope with Lincoln's quick fire passing and cute ones and twos. When, in the 2nd half, Dann and Roper were reunited in central defence and Westwood went right back in the 2nd half, guess what? Lincoln didn't have a shot on goal. Ince didnt stand a chance with either goal but again looked hesitant and almost dropped another clanger from a corner in the 2nd half, but luckily the defense were able to hack the ball away. Taylor showed again tonight why last season he was playing non league football

In midfield, again Wright was superb and the only attacking outlet. I will say this, despite his critics, if we had another Wright on the left wing, at least we would look threatening more often. Keates ran around and worked hard but again the game bypassed him often. Peade same as Keates. Fox continued to look the non league player he has looked in almost every game he has played. And now we come to Dobson. I have supported him earlier in the season and backed him. But he has been getting worse in the last 2 months and tonight was possibly the worst 45 mins i have seen by a Wasall player. Gave away both goals. Rarely won a tackle. And gave away the ball 95-99% of the time. The only surprise was that it took until half time to sub him. People were screaming for him not to be given the ball as he was a disaster waiting to happen. I remember during RG's 1st promotion campaign early in the season in a home game against York. Keates had a mare and by around half way in the 1st half we were 2 goals down and Keates i think had a hand to play in both goals conceded and RG subbed him half way in the 1st half. Should have happened to Dobson today

Up front Sam took his goal well and worked very hard. The kindest thing one can say about Cederquist so far is that he looks like a striker version of Dakinah(remember him!). Looks bewildered and out of his depth. Butler great as usual. Had 2 one on ones in the 2nd half. Weak finish for the 1st and unlucky for the 2nd. But spent too long having to pick the ball up in midfield and down the wings and having to do the donkey work(due to inadequecys of others) when he should be in the box. I wonder how many goals Butler would have scored this season had he been playing for a team that creates plenty of chances like Lincoln or Swindon?!

We succeeded earlier in the season unlike now because we kept clean sheets. Now Ince and the defense are conceding the odd goal or two and teams have worked us out, we are struggling. Midfield is the same as it was earlier in the season(crap) and up front the same(wonderful given the lack of service). Problem is when you only score the odd goal per match and only create about 1 or 2 other chances(like we did tonight and again against Boston and Rochdale), unless you keep a clean sheet, you are not going to win matches

Our blip has now been going on for over 2 months. If it carries on another few games, i will stop looking how Swindon and Lincoln get on and start worrying about teams like Bristol Rovers and hope that we don't actually throw even a play off place away! I have just spoken to a friend in Manchester whose house i am staying at for the Stockport game. He says that Stockport have just won several games in a row and not even conceded a goal. Oh dear !


Excellent post LS.

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WFC_Rob
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Fri Feb 16, 2007 11:33 pm

London Saddler wrote:In midfield, again Wright was superb and the only attacking outlet. I will say this, despite his critics, if we had another Wright on the left wing, at least we would look threatening more often.

Are you for real?
Please can you point out what he contribued tonight, without using the old 'but he was no worse than anyone else' - people say that about him every week.
He needs replacing this week. We can't afford to carry him every single game. Almost every single team we've played has a right sided player wo is better than him. He gets into the side because we have no-one better (apparently) - that's very worrying.

Dobson had a shocker tonight - he was worse than usual by a great deal. I would like to take this opportunity however to point out something worth considering before he gets battered from pillar to post:
What reasons are there behind players giving the ball away? If Dobson had an easy ball to play every time he receives it, he wouldn't give it away would he? Mr. Wright, Mr. Fox and Mr. Keates are nowhere to be seen when Dobson has the ball. I don't know about the rest of you, but I'm not so sure I can defend players who shirk away from responsibility and hide from the ball.
That's not an excuse for Dobson't nightmare by any means, but it's certainly a contributory factor as far as I'm concerned.

Westwood gave yet another assured performance at the back. He was the one player who I felt didn't deserve to be on the losing side tonight - I challenge anyone to find me a better defensive performance at this level than his this evening.

Sam was particularly good in the first half and finished superbly for his goal. Unfortunately, he did his usual in the second half - frustration got the better of him and he was taken off after diving a couple of times (one particularly embarassing attempt at winning a penalty) and generally not getting involved. Not taking anything away from his first half performance though - that was one of the positives to take from the match.
Butler worked his socks off yet again, but if we're being honest, should have taken the 2 chances he had in the second half. Cederqvist showed glimpses of promise, but was again let down by service which can only be described as unacceptable.

Well, where do we go from here? I assume the same sort of side will try to scrap a point away from Stockport, which is a massive task. Richard Money then needs to bring at least 2 players in to improve the side. It can't be too difficult, surely? A right sided midfielder and a central midfielder capable of linking defence to attack are a must. I seriously think we can hope for play-offs at best unless this happens. A left-sided midfielder should be next on the shopping list, as it looks like Ishmel isn't going to get a chance.

As has been said before today's game, we've been found out. This isn't helped by a widespread lack of confidence, but a shake-up in some form is required if we're going to maintain our top 3 position.

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Fri Feb 16, 2007 11:35 pm

London Saddler wrote:Terrific atmosphere. Well done to the fans who were superb. But unfortunately another poor performance and another dreadful result. And again the opposition looked very comfortable. Difficult to say how good Lincoln were as currently we are making most teams look good

Wrong team selection to start with. Those who have seen us last season know Ropes and Westwood in centrral defence does not work. It didn't work today. When Westwood has been great at right back this season and Dann commanding at centre half, why was Dann dropped? Also bizarre 2nd and 3rd substitutions. Wrack on for Taylor? Wrack who in his last home appearance made Wright look like Ronaldinho was bought onto the left wing. Offered nothing tonight going forward or defensively. And Sam (one of our best players tonight) off and Cederquist on (did nothing again)

The goals we conceded were simple and down to Dobson. Both times, under no pressure, he stood there wondering what to do, was easily dispossed, and 2-3 passes later each time the ball was in the back of the net

Defensively we were shambles in the 1st half and unable to cope with Lincoln's quick fire passing and cute ones and twos. When, in the 2nd half, Dann and Roper were reunited in central defence and Westwood went right back in the 2nd half, guess what? Lincoln didn't have a shot on goal. Ince didnt stand a chance with either goal but again looked hesitant and almost dropped another clanger from a corner in the 2nd half, but luckily the defense were able to hack the ball away. Taylor showed again tonight why last season he was playing non league football

In midfield, again Wright was superb and the only attacking outlet. I will say this, despite his critics, if we had another Wright on the left wing, at least we would look threatening more often. Keates ran around and worked hard but again the game bypassed him often. Peade same as Keates. Fox continued to look the non league player he has looked in almost every game he has played. And now we come to Dobson. I have supported him earlier in the season and backed him. But he has been getting worse in the last 2 months and tonight was possibly the worst 45 mins i have seen by a Wasall player. Gave away both goals. Rarely won a tackle. And gave away the ball 95-99% of the time. The only surprise was that it took until half time to sub him. People were screaming for him not to be given the ball as he was a disaster waiting to happen. I remember during RG's 1st promotion campaign early in the season in a home game against York. Keates had a mare and by around half way in the 1st half we were 2 goals down and Keates i think had a hand to play in both goals conceded and RG subbed him half way in the 1st half. Should have happened to Dobson today

Up front Sam took his goal well and worked very hard. The kindest thing one can say about Cederquist so far is that he looks like a striker version of Dakinah(remember him!). Looks bewildered and out of his depth. Butler great as usual. Had 2 one on ones in the 2nd half. Weak finish for the 1st and unlucky for the 2nd. But spent too long having to pick the ball up in midfield and down the wings and having to do the donkey work(due to inadequecys of others) when he should be in the box. I wonder how many goals Butler would have scored this season had he been playing for a team that creates plenty of chances like Lincoln or Swindon?!

We succeeded earlier in the season unlike now because we kept clean sheets. Now Ince and the defense are conceding the odd goal or two and teams have worked us out, we are struggling. Midfield is the same as it was earlier in the season(crap) and up front the same(wonderful given the lack of service). Problem is when you only score the odd goal per match and only create about 1 or 2 other chances(like we did tonight and again against Boston and Rochdale), unless you keep a clean sheet, you are not going to win matches

Our blip has now been going on for over 2 months. If it carries on another few games, i will stop looking how Swindon and Lincoln get on and start worrying about teams like Bristol Rovers and hope that we don't actually throw even a play off place away! I have just spoken to a friend in Manchester whose house i am staying at for the Stockport game. He says that Stockport have just won several games in a row and not even conceded a goal. Oh dear !


Better not turn up then. Lets just save everyone the bother and award Stockport the win now because they are obviously brilliant. I hear they are 6th in League Two, having won a few games, Yikes!!!!

Tell you what, instead, why don't we accept a couple of defeats like good sports people, accept that the oppostion have played well and exploited our mistakes, but also as supporters, realise that this is what happens and that tuesday represents another big threat to our chances of promotion. I fear Stockport no more than when we played them second game of the season when we .....post Merson Walsall Fc could have been heading for the Conference. The whole mindset of the club is wrong at the moment, but it will take only a couple of wins to change that and we need to play our part as supporters.

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Fri Feb 16, 2007 11:40 pm

Geordie , i wish we had more fans like you . you talk a lot of sense mate

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Fri Feb 16, 2007 11:50 pm

How long are we going to say that a couple of wins will turn it around/change peoples minds? If you truly think we are substantially better than last season, then I am worried. In a division that is markedly worse than the one above, we are now being found wanting. One win in six games - oh, how we have improved!

Please don't say 'look at the table' - say it at the end of the season, when we will more than likely be in the play-offs. And prepare for another season in this division.

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Sat Feb 17, 2007 12:11 am

Looks like Mr Dosh have just out we have a big hole in the middle of our team THE MIDFIELD. After having a good game last week Dobson was back to his usual self lazy,poor passing , what has gone wrong with Dobson at the start of the season he looked areal great signing but since his head injury he has turned into a non league player. Since Kins left for Charlton we have lost the player who could make a killer pass, or someone to slow the game or take the game by the scruff of it neck .

With 20 mins left the game was crying out for some pace in Ishmel, but once again he was left on the bench for Cederqvist who still looks even poorer than Constable, also why oh why does he keep taking Sam off, Sam was one of the best players on the pitch. Could he have not took Wright or Keates of and gone 4-3-3.

On Wm Dicky say's he thinks he will be able to get a player in for the Barnet game , I do hope he does before we slide into 4th place

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Sat Feb 17, 2007 12:29 am

Pedro wrote:Looks like Mr Dosh have just out we have a big hole in the middle of our team THE MIDFIELD. After having a good game last week Dobson was back to his usual self lazy,poor passing , what has gone wrong with Dobson at the start of the season he looked areal great signing but since his head injury he has turned into a non league player. Since Kins left for Charlton we have lost the player who could make a killer pass, or someone to slow the game or take the game by the scruff of it neck .

With 20 mins left the game was crying out for some pace in Ishmel, but once again he was left on the bench for Cederqvist who still looks even poorer than Constable, also why oh why does he keep taking Sam off, Sam was one of the best players on the pitch. Could he have not took Wright or Keates of and gone 4-3-3.

On Wm Dicky say's he thinks he will be able to get a player in for the Barnet game , I do hope he does before we slide into 4th place


Totally agree with that mate.

Also why did he bring wrack on, i like wrack but he offes us nothing on the left and he is pretty paceless now.

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Pedro
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Sat Feb 17, 2007 12:36 am

Wrack would have been ok in the middle , he can pass the ball and knows what to do with it .Playing him on the wing though is crazy he has lost his pace and cannot beat a man. He least can sit in the middle of the park leaving Keates to do all the running while he make some decent passes

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Sat Feb 17, 2007 12:40 am

Pedro wrote:Looks like Mr Dosh have just out we have a big hole in the middle of our team THE MIDFIELD. After having a good game last week Dobson was back to his usual self lazy,poor passing , what has gone wrong with Dobson at the start of the season he looked areal great signing but since his head injury he has turned into a non league player. Since Kins left for Charlton we have lost the player who could make a killer pass, or someone to slow the game or take the game by the scruff of it neck .

With 20 mins left the game was crying out for some pace in Ishmel, but once again he was left on the bench for Cederqvist who still looks even poorer than Constable, also why oh why does he keep taking Sam off, Sam was one of the best players on the pitch. Could he have not took Wright or Keates of and gone 4-3-3.

On Wm Dicky say's he thinks he will be able to get a player in for the Barnet game , I do hope he does before we slide into 4th place


Not a chance , JB will soon put a stop to that , hey Phil :roll:

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Sat Feb 17, 2007 1:07 am

I think it's fair comment that we've played worse this season and won games. We had several chances but didn't finish well. If my memory isn't playing tricks, Lincoln had less clear-cut opportunities but took two of them clinically.
What was worrying is that Lincoln played in a way which should have allowed us to play the passing game that I, and I suspect others, appreciate. Lincoln weren't 'In our faces', unlike a number of our recent opponents, yet we weren't able to play consistantly well.

As much stick as Wright (justifiably or not) takes, at least he provides a constant presence, on the right of the field. I'm disappointed that we don't have the same option on the left side of the pitch. I find it hard to define the roles of Fox and Taylor. I assume the idea is that they interchange and cover for each other. I don't feel it's working; certainly not in the way that Pedro and Zigor could when they were on their games.

The Boston manager recently said that he that he still thought we were the best team in the Division as he felt our squad gave us more options than other teams. Whilst I feel that is true of our Defence I don't feel we are living up to his estimation in Midfield or Attack. Martin Butler spends an increasing amount of the game doing work wide or deep rather than being the constant threat we need up front.
This seems to reinforce the point, made by many people, that we lack presence in Midfield. I know Dobson had a mare tonight, for whatever reason, but I like him-when he can play to his strengths rather than having to do all the grafting and tidying up on his own. He's inherited the mantle of Tom Bennett, who was always getting slagged off every time he made a mistake, despite being the 'Lone Ranger' in the middle of the park on many occasions, without people appreciating the work he did. I'm sure Money realises we need a genuine creative midfielder.

Money was very keen to tell us that he thought Cederquist would provide problems for defences with his power and strength. I'm sure he has the potential to do that but he seems a long way from being the finished article at present. Money fears that fans' criticism will have a negative effect on him,as no doubt it may; but that's because he was presented to us as what we needed now rather than being 'one for the future'. The decision to sell Constable is still questionable. I was impressed with Barry Conlon when he played against us, recently, for Mansfield. I also remember him as a constant thorn in our side when he played for Barnsley in years gone by. That's what I'd want from PC but he's still finding his feet at the moment.

I'm really looking forward to Tuesday's match. I still feel we have it in us to win this League. Over the years, Saddlers fans have watched us snatch defeat from the jaws of victory on numerous occasions. The old cliche regarding the 'Annual fight against Promotion' springs to mind. At the start of the season I'd have settled for automatic promotion. I'll still be satisfied with that, though, given the dominant position which we had only a short while ago, I'll consider that we could have had a record-breaking season as well.
There's a lot of football to be played yet. I was hoping that by the time we all descended on Torquay at Easter we would be able to be in party mood. It seems though we'll still have serious business to conduct.

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Sat Feb 17, 2007 1:21 am

I thought Lincoln were very much like we were, earlier in the season - deadly on the break, efficient at the back, happy to concede posession so long as it didn't lead anywhere. We were, as we have been for ages, hopeless in midfield. We had so much posession but created so little. For sure, Butler had two good chances which he fluffed, but we just didn't create enough. Wright had a good game but as usual was fighting a one-man battle. Keates and Pead in the centre of midfield? Give me a break. Nice to hear Money say on WM that he knows we need a signing (presumably a midfielder), but it's been obvious for so long - Fox isn't good enough, Keates isn't good enough, Pead isn't good enough and Dobson was shocking tonight.

Couldn't understand why Dann was dropped - maybe he thought Westwood's pace (is he quicker than Dann?) would be better against their terrific centre-forward. But Dann's been the best player of recent weeks, so to drop him was bizarre. Bringing Wrack on to the left wing instead of Demontagnac was insane (Ishmel seems to have been written off based on his poor performance in our last home game - whereas others are given chance after chance despite being poor on a consistent basis). Did Wrack actually touch the ball? Replacing Sam with Cederqvist was also insane. Sam was probably our best player and looked the most likely to do anything. Cederqvist looked like a parks player again. He is so much worse than Constable it's untrue.

I'm very pleased that it seems we will be bringing in new blood. DD's had a mixed time so far with his signings (for every Butler and Ince, there's a Bedeau or Picken or Lyall) - let's hope he pulls another good one out of the bag. We need it, desperately. Our second-half tactics of getting the ball to Dann so he could pump long balls up were awful to see.

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Sat Feb 17, 2007 1:59 am

They had Spencer Weir Daley, we didnt. I think he's one of the best players ive seen in this league, interesting to see him not go down for one of their goals he could of easily had a penalty. Good to see, bad to see he put it in the back of the net.

Unlike Mr Sam, diving when if he'd of stayed on his feet and made a simple pass across the box butler would of tapped it in.

They had alot of pace in their team tonight and there the best team ive seen lately.

Next 3 games are very important, after that we have Mcdonalds and Wycombe away.

I am hopeful of a new face, and i thought DD's comments were good on WM, he knows what we need. This is where his managerial abilities will really be tested. Bring it on.

When was the last time Ciderfest actually had a shot?

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Sat Feb 17, 2007 2:24 am

latviancheese wrote:They had Spencer Weir Daley, we didnt. I think he's one of the best players ive seen in this league, interesting to see him not go down for one of their goals he could of easily had a penalty. Good to see, bad to see he put it in the back of the net.

Unlike Mr Sam, diving when if he'd of stayed on his feet and made a simple pass across the box butler would of tapped it in.

They had alot of pace in their team tonight and there the best team ive seen lately.

Next 3 games are very important, after that we have Mcdonalds and Wycombe away.

I am hopeful of a new face, and i thought DD's comments were good on WM, he knows what we need. This is where his managerial abilities will really be tested. Bring it on.

When was the last time Ciderfest actually had a shot?

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Sam had already lost control of the ball when he went down, it wasn't a simple pass at all. Last week in a similar siuation he beat 3 challenges when he could have gone down, rounded the keeper, and pulled the ball back for king Ishmel to take the glory af being the first man since september to score a winning goal against Hartlepool, but the brainless numbty put the ball in row Z.

Last time we won a home game Sam produced the cross of the season to initiate a goal, he is far and away our best forward at the moment and has been for about two months. As for Richard Fairbrass having a shot, I think he's got more chance of being number one next Christmas.

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Sat Feb 17, 2007 2:53 am

I wouldn't play Dobson in my Sunday League side.

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Sat Feb 17, 2007 8:33 am

Dobson had a shocker tonight - he was worse than usual by a great deal. I would like to take this opportunity however to point out something worth considering before he gets battered from pillar to post:
What reasons are there behind players giving the ball away? If Dobson had an easy ball to play every time he receives it, he wouldn't give it away would he? Mr. Wright, Mr. Fox and Mr. Keates are nowhere to be seen when Dobson has the ball. I don't know about the rest of you, but I'm not so sure I can defend players who shirk away from responsibility and hide from the ball.
That's not an excuse for Dobson't nightmare by any means, but it's certainly a contributory factor as far as I'm concerned.


Agreed - again, I am not excusing the poor performance, but some of the passing by his colleagues to him left a lot to be desired - and that was the case leading to the first goal from memory.... no excuse for the secong though. Keates gets away with similar mistakes because "he's a local lad". Midfield definately in need of fresh legs (some that can pass preferably). When DD made the sub at HT, I was hoping he was going to try Dann in midfield, as he has shown he may be an option with his passing and movement.

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Sat Feb 17, 2007 9:11 am

WFC_Rob wrote:Dobson had a shocker tonight - he was worse than usual by a great deal. I would like to take this opportunity however to point out something worth considering before he gets battered from pillar to post:
What reasons are there behind players giving the ball away? If Dobson had an easy ball to play every time he receives it, he wouldn't give it away would he? Mr. Wright, Mr. Fox and Mr. Keates are nowhere to be seen when Dobson has the ball. I don't know about the rest of you, but I'm not so sure I can defend players who shirk away from responsibility and hide from the ball.


Spot on WFC_Rob. I've been a big supporter of Dobson's role in the team...but even I can't deny the fact that he had an absolute mare last night. BUT.......every time he got the ball, there were no simple options for him. Need to see the first goal again...but who passed it to him when he'd got an opposition player bearing down on him. Several of the other wayward passes he made....where were the simple 10 yard passes he needs to make to the more creative players?

I'll say this to all you Dobson/Wright/Taylor haters....WATCH the next time they play. These three, whether they're playing well or playing badly, always, ALWAYS offer themselves for the pass. They see more of the ball than anyone else so they make more mistakes. Simple equation really. Then, having noticed this, take a look at the likes of Fox, Pead, Keates, Wrack etc - do they make themselves available for the pass? No, they go hiding behind the opposition.

Fox in particular is the poorest excuse for a player I've seen in years...and yet he appears to be a manager's favourite with Taylor being the fall-guy. Butler was absolutely livid with him on one occasion in the 1st half. As Butler battled with 2 Lincoln men on him, all Fox needed to do was move a few yards and ask for the pass. Instead, he hid behind his marker, moved away from the action and we lost the ball.

Overall assessments;

Ince - this used to happen with Walker from time to time...whereas earlier in the season he was making a "wonder save" in most games, without doing too much wrong, when was the last time he actually made one of those saves? Seen the first goal again, may have done better with it.
Pead - I thought poor at full-back, occasionally effective in midfield
Taylor - thought he had a reasonable game. Yes, some wayard passing but see comments above re lack of options, particularly up the left wing, whenever he got the ball.
Westwood - ok at centre-half, quite simply outstanding at fullback
Roper - at fault for the 2nd goal, wholehearted as always.
Wright - our attacking outlet. Did some good work. A reasonable game I thought
Dobson - a mare! Although, doing the job he's good at, tracked a midfielder back and made one superb headed interception to stop a certain goal. Did you notice that Dobson haters?
Keates - considering his limited talents, I thought he had a decent game (take note MMF!). He is what he is, but he battled and showed a little bit of quality at times.
Fox - waste of space.
Sam - very effective 1st half. Have to say, by the time he was subbed, felt he had really gone out the game. Forget who the sub is for a moment, I think it was time for him to go off.
Butler - worked hard in all the "wrong" areas. Difference in the end between the two teams was Weir-Daley scored with two terrific shots, Butler had similar opportunities and hit weak shots.
Dann - thought he showed why he'd been dropped. Some wayward passing. Would love to see him get a game in midfield alongside Dobson though. Make Dobson the anchor and allow Dann to get into the box.
Wrack - see Fox!
Cederquist - jsut doesn't look like he's in the game at all. 3rd Division football is just passing him by.

One other point to note.....2nd half,we pinned Lincoln back in their own half. Thta's because we really attacked them (we had NO other option with a midfield like that). Yes, they had the odd break but we generally had incessant pressure without really being troubled at the back. Sort of makes me wonder whether, if we'd adopted this attacking approach all season, it would have been like this in most matches? I understand the "grind out 1-0 results" approach....but I actually think we're good enough to have not given quite so much respect to the opposition this season.

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toffo
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Sat Feb 17, 2007 9:30 am

Fox- needs to be dropped
Taylor - not a fullback
Keates - too slow
Dobson - turning circle of a tank
Westwood - keep him at fullback
Pead - too lightweight

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Sat Feb 17, 2007 10:08 am

Great post mel58, I agree with every word. I would like to think that DD has also identified those key areas of concern and knows how to tweak things to help us get the results again, but his decisions yesterday (taking off Sam, putting Wrack on the left wing) suggest otherwise.

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Sat Feb 17, 2007 10:11 am

The critics of Dobson should realise that his 200 games in defence for Brentford proved that he is a good third division defender who has been played in the wrong position all season.

As a defender he reads the game well when we are not in possession, is a good tackler and a very good header of the ball.

For a midfielder he is poor at passing forwards, cannot beat a man, does not have a brilliant touch, and does not see the best attacking opportunies.

Why is DD playing him in midfield?

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Sat Feb 17, 2007 10:15 am


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Sat Feb 17, 2007 10:25 am

Can't understand some of the critisism of Wrighty, I thought he was our best player tonight. Looked to beat his full back when he got the ball and put some good crosses into the box. What happened on our left side??? again...

Ropes had a steady game but was at fault for the 2nd, he should have stepped up (he was 5 yards behind the rest of our defence) and Wier Daley would have been offside.

Dobbo - nuff said already.

Deano played okay but didn't have any time on the ball.

Lincoln harried and pressed us (i didn't think they would be able to keep it up for 90 mins but they did) and didn't allow us to play football. Fair play to them.

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Sat Feb 17, 2007 10:34 am

kevwill wrote:How long are we going to say that a couple of wins will turn it around/change peoples minds? If you truly think we are substantially better than last season, then I am worried. In a division that is markedly worse than the one above, we are now being found wanting. One win in six games - oh, how we have improved!

Please don't say 'look at the table' - say it at the end of the season, when we will more than likely be in the play-offs. And prepare for another season in this division.


I totally agree. The arguement to 'look at the table' is wearing abit thin now. No-one has ever argued against the league position but a few posters have been pointing out that playing the way have have been for the majority of the season was always going to lead to problems. We have a manager that doesn't appear to see the weaknesses let alone deal with them. As for having a go at the supporters he ought to be looking at himself and the team performances and ask himself if the booing was warranted. If he is looking to bring someone in for the Barnet game why the hell didn't he do it during the window - or does he honestly think we were SO good we couldn't improve? The chances are anyone we get now will be done in a panic and will probably be no good. Once we lose top spot will we recover? I don't think so - I would love to be wrong!

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Duke
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Sat Feb 17, 2007 10:40 am

A Bit unfair to blame Roper for the second, the pass was excellent not much any defender can do about that.

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Sat Feb 17, 2007 12:25 pm

I didnt want to post straight away, I wanted to collect my thoughts and calm down.

It all comes down to teams working us out. Simple as that. All we ever do is work the ball into the full back positions or similar, and every single effin time, play the ball down the left or (mainly) right channel, for Butler or Sam to run onto. This worked earlier in the season, because teams were playing a higher line, so we could get in behind easier. Now all teams have to do is drop 15 yards deeper, and we are totally clueless going forward.

This is the exact reason why we need a player like Lee Frecklington, who was absolutely superb last ngiht i thought, a midfielder who actually tries to go past people - thus creating space to open up play/defences. Exactly what we need. Our wings are not good enough, we need to strengthen there as well, if we are going to finish well.

Why on earth didnt we sign spencer weir-daley ? A player i suggested at the time he went back to forest (that ones for registered saddler! :D ) I think we need 3 players to be honest. An attacking midfielder, a left winger, and a quick nipply small striker to turn defences.

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Fray Bentos is God!
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Sat Feb 17, 2007 12:45 pm

wednesbury Saddler METFAN wrote:I didnt want to post straight away, I wanted to collect my thoughts and calm down.

It all comes down to teams working us out. Simple as that. All we ever do is work the ball into the full back positions or similar, and every single effin time, play the ball down the left or (mainly) right channel, for Butler or Sam to run onto. This worked earlier in the season, because teams were playing a higher line, so we could get in behind easier. Now all teams have to do is drop 15 yards deeper, and we are totally clueless going forward.

This is the exact reason why we need a player like Lee Frecklington, who was absolutely superb last ngiht i thought, a midfielder who actually tries to go past people - thus creating space to open up play/defences. Exactly what we need. Our wings are not good enough, we need to strengthen there as well, if we are going to finish well.

Why on earth didnt we sign spencer weir-daley ? A player i suggested at the time he went back to forest (that ones for registered saddler! :D ) I think we need 3 players to be honest. An attacking midfielder, a left winger, and a quick nipply small striker to turn defences.


Funny he ay a right winger :D

Do agree with you though about needing a LF type player and a left winger.

Im also getting a bit tired of Sam being the sacrificial lamp to Par

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Sat Feb 17, 2007 2:03 pm

wednesbury Saddler METFAN wrote:Why on earth didnt we sign spencer weir-daley ? A player i suggested at the time he went back to forest (that ones for registered saddler! :D ) I think we need 3 players to be honest. An attacking midfielder, a left winger, and a quick nipply small striker to turn defences.


Oi! I didn't notice Weir-Daley playing on the right wing last night. He was a handful though. Frecklington is probably the best midfielder in the division, and we absolutely could do with someone of his quality. They don't grow on trees though and it's our job to unearth someone who can add some kind attacking impetus from the centre of midfield.

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Sat Feb 17, 2007 2:11 pm

I was at the game last night and came away very frustrated but not disconsolate. With a bit of luck we could have got a draw out of the game in my opinion. I'm not saying that we would have necessarily deserved it, but we could have and this division isn't always about what you deserve, it's what you get.

Lincoln did what they needed to do and had a player in Weir-Daley who was able to punish the two mistakes. Dobson will hopefully be feeling bad about that performance because it was a bad night for him, but I hope that his confidence isn't broken beyond repair because I honestly think he can be a very good player for us.

It was a game of two different styles in my opinion and Lincoln's proved more effective on the night, in so much as they came away with the three points, but for large parts we did dominate the play. DD's style may not be to everyone's liking but it has got us where we are at present, so it can't be that bad. I'm still in confident mood, I'm disappointed, but I'm confident that this is just a blip and we can turn it around. The way I see it is that a win at Stockport in midweek would be the ideal tonic, but whatever happens there, a win at home to Barnet next weekend is essential. Can't make it to Stockport but I'll be there next weekend.

Bringing in new players is all well and good and I hope that we bring in a quality midfielder, but I think when the players that we've got at the minute click, get it right as a group, and get that bit of luck that any team at any level need now and again, we can beat anyone in this division.

There's no point dwelling on the last few weeks because it won't do us any good. I'm not overjoyed at the moment, but all we can do is put our faith in DD and the players to sort it out. They'll know as well as any of us that things haven't been quite right recently, the results speak for themselves, but they'll also know that the improvement has got to come from them on the pitch and I'm confident that we'll see that either at Stockport or against Barnet this week.

You can see it in the players when they're shouting at each other for little mistakes that they know they need to be doing better as a team I think and if we get a good start under our belts against Stockport, with the Hartlepool game still fresh in our minds, we'll get the three points that we need to lift spirits and get us back on track.

Whatever happens, another performance from the crowd like last night will go a long way to lifting the players next weekend.

UP THE SADDLERS.

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Jolly Johnny
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Sat Feb 17, 2007 2:21 pm

WFC_Rob wrote:Dobson had a shocker tonight - he was worse than usual by a great deal. I would like to take this opportunity however to point out something worth considering before he gets battered from pillar to post:
What reasons are there behind players giving the ball away? If Dobson had an easy ball to play every time he receives it, he wouldn't give it away would he? Mr. Wright, Mr. Fox and Mr. Keates are nowhere to be seen when Dobson has the ball. I don't know about the rest of you, but I'm not so sure I can defend players who shirk away from responsibility and hide from the ball.
That's not an excuse for Dobson't nightmare by any means, but it's certainly a contributory factor as far as I'm concerned.


Spot on there. I mentioned much the same earlier in a thread about Dobbo having a mare on the All About Walsall page.

I also agree with others about some of the substitutions. It was crying out for Ishy on for Fox or Taylor down the left hand side - Wrack didn't threaten them and, as others have mentioned, has no pace left and really can only play in the middle now or maybe as full bac cover. Sam was unlucky to come off, he had had a good game, albeit with THAT dive!!

As usual, the Wright argument takes both sides again. I'd say he was our best outlet in the game BUT, that isn't saying much i'm afraid. Second half he did try and get at the full back on a few occasions but he bottled too many challenges and if he didn't get the ball hung his head or jogged another 15 yards before turning around to get back - too lazy. That said, we have NOTHING down the left, so no wonder we keep trying the Wright angle. We really need to sort that side out - see it's not only England with that problem!!

The next two games have to be wins for me, at Stockport and then home against Barnet. Ae weren't atrocious last night, just made bad mistakes and certain team members were lacking which doesn't help the overall performance.

I'm hoping to be there on Tuesday night, I'll be cheering and hope the great away fans we've had all season will too, and it'll spur us on to a win which we need and will lift us.

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