Chester (A) League - Friday 6/10/06

[Percie]

Cully is spot on. Platitudes about 'getting an away point' show incredibly low expectations against a football club that has more in common with Chasetown FC than the Saddlers. This time last year we were rightly sharing our disappointment at PM's close season signings. I truly believe that, Butler apart, DD has weakened the squad that finished bottom of League 1. It's been along time since Wrack performed well but if he's made any sort of recovery he'll add more to the team than Dobbo's, Fangy's and Bedeau's contributions combined. Giving blind adulation to everything DD does simply because of who he is not is as ridiculous as the praise heaped Sven for not losing against tiny footballing nations in qualifying games.

Who let mongoloids onto computers, youre a worse wind up than me!

So you admit your a wind up then? ;)

I can wind you up percie..... Your mom :P :P

See!

*Offically wound up* :x

At least I don't have 6 fingers. You frreak from Willenhall, you! :D

[Duke]

A game this time last season we would have lost , like many of you i'm disappointed with the performance, but can't fault the players battling spirit , effort . work rate and commitment . We are top of the league there to be shot at . teams we play will raise thier game against us .something we have to live with.
As Neil says win at home, draw away , thats a championship winning team.


UP THE SADDLERS

[Geordiesaddler]

I'm afraid that some people just don't understand 1) what getting out of this division is all about and 2) What the state of ths club was 6 months ago. We are on course to lose no more than about half a dozen games at worse this season, and if we achieve that we will win promotion and most probably the championship. Contrast that with for example MK Dons who have now lost 4 games, inluding Chester, Mansfield, and Peterborough, three teams that couldn't muster a goal against us between them.
And that is the second point of my argument, 6 months ago we were a rag-tag pub team that couldn't defend. Dosh has got the basics right, we are not world beaters or even that good to watch half the time, but we are organised and very very difficult to beat - do not under-estimate the achievement of turning what we were at the end of last season into a team that is difficult to beat. Wycombe and Lincoln are the "pretty teams" in this league, but mark my words we will finish above them in this 46 game slog. Seven goals conceeded in 13 games is the telling statistic at this stage, our top scorer has managed as many goals this season as the opposition has managed against us.

[Bernie]

A very disappointing performance. Chester were, like most teams we have faced this season, absolutely dire, but they were by far the better team.

I cannot understand those who like Dobson - he was his usual rubbish - not in the game much, giving the ball away, creating nothing. Bedeau can go now into non league football where he belongs.

We went 90 minutes without us having a single chance.

Good points are that we defended well enough to keep Chester out, and Bossu did everything asked of him.

The only time we were in the game was at the start of the second half. Whether this was because it took Chester 15 minutes to work out how to deal with the wind in their faces, or because for a time we had 5 in midfield I am not sure. When DD made the mistake of putting Dann on as centre forward we reverted to rubbish. Just because Dann has scored a couple of goals it does not mean that he can play as a centre forward. Please don't repeat that mistake DD - he is a good defender, but no forward.

Not only was the game completely without excitement or interest, but the pies cost £2.40 and £1.70 for a bottle of pop.

[Fray Bentos is God!]

I'm afraid that some people just don't understand 1) what getting out of this division is all about and 2) What the state of ths club was 6 months ago. We are on course to lose no more than about half a dozen games at worse this season, and if we achieve that we will win promotion and most probably the championship. Contrast that with for example MK Dons who have now lost 4 games, inluding Chester, Mansfield, and Peterborough, three teams that couldn't muster a goal against us between them.
And that is the second point of my argument, 6 months ago we were a rag-tag pub team that couldn't defend. Dosh has got the basics right, we are not world beaters or even that good to watch half the time, but we are organised and very very difficult to beat - do not under-estimate the achievement of turning what we were at the end of last season into a team that is difficult to beat. Wycombe and Lincoln are the "pretty teams" in this league, but mark my words we will finish above them in this 46 game slog. Seven goals conceeded in 13 games is the telling statistic at this stage, our top scorer has managed as many goals this season as the opposition has managed against us.

A game this time last season we would have lost , like many of you i'm disappointed with the performance, but can't fault the players battling spirit , effort . work rate and commitment . We are top of the league there to be shot at . teams we play will raise thier game against us .something we have to live with.
As Neil says win at home, draw away , thats a championship winning team.


UP THE SADDLERS

Very true, even if we only make the playoffs the way DD has turned the whole club around from laughing stock to champion contenders is an amazing feat and if every away game has to resemble footballs Somme then so bloody be it!

[Duke]

I'm afraid that some people just don't understand 1) what getting out of this division is all about and 2) What the state of ths club was 6 months ago. We are on course to lose no more than about half a dozen games at worse this season, and if we achieve that we will win promotion and most probably the championship. Contrast that with for example MK Dons who have now lost 4 games, inluding Chester, Mansfield, and Peterborough, three teams that couldn't muster a goal against us between them.
And that is the second point of my argument, 6 months ago we were a rag-tag pub team that couldn't defend. Dosh has got the basics right, we are not world beaters or even that good to watch half the time, but we are organised and very very difficult to beat - do not under-estimate the achievement of turning what we were at the end of last season into a team that is difficult to beat. Wycombe and Lincoln are the "pretty teams" in this league, but mark my words we will finish above them in this 46 game slog. Seven goals conceeded in 13 games is the telling statistic at this stage, our top scorer has managed as many goals this season as the opposition has managed against us.

Good stuff Geordie , you do talk some sense .
Look whats happened siince we hammered Peterborough 5-0.
They have won at Swindon and M K Dons .
Fans expect to us play like Brazil every week and thrash team 4 or 5 .
it just don't happen like that this is basement football , its a battle, scrap, a dog fight we are winning , at times it aint pretty but its working.


A word about our away support last night OUTSTANDING

[Jolly Johnny]

I am spot on. Platitudes about 'getting an away point' show incredibly low expectations against a football club that has more in common with Chasetown FC than the Saddlers. This time last year we were rightly sharing our disappointment at PM's close season signings. I truly believe that, Constable apart, PM has weakened the squad that was relegated from the Championship. It's been a long time since Wrack performed well but if he's made any sort of recovery he'll add more to the team than Paul Smith, Broad or Barrowman's contributions combined. Giving blind adulation to everything PM does simply because of who he is not is as ridiculous as the praise heaped Sven for not losing against tiny footballing nations in qualifying games.

You are a wind-up. Brilliant stuff.

Love it Exile - nice piece of editing!!!!

[Jolly Johnny]

I'm afraid that some people just don't understand 1) what getting out of this division is all about and 2) What the state of ths club was 6 months ago. We are on course to lose no more than about half a dozen games at worse this season, and if we achieve that we will win promotion and most probably the championship. Contrast that with for example MK Dons who have now lost 4 games, inluding Chester, Mansfield, and Peterborough, three teams that couldn't muster a goal against us between them.
And that is the second point of my argument, 6 months ago we were a rag-tag pub team that couldn't defend. Dosh has got the basics right, we are not world beaters or even that good to watch half the time, but we are organised and very very difficult to beat - do not under-estimate the achievement of turning what we were at the end of last season into a team that is difficult to beat. Wycombe and Lincoln are the "pretty teams" in this league, but mark my words we will finish above them in this 46 game slog. Seven goals conceeded in 13 games is the telling statistic at this stage, our top scorer has managed as many goals this season as the opposition has managed against us.

Super post Geordie. Absolutely right that we are hard to beat. Westwood and Taylor didn't have great games last night yet I can't remember them really getting behind us (although maybe second half when we were at other end it wasn't clear to see if they had I suppose!) Apart from a goal that was ruled out for offside in the first half we kept them out and Roper and Gerrard were solid (Roper was excellent in fact). It was always going to be difficult last night with the weather etc so a point was very welcome. After 15 mins I said to my mate next to me, "let's take 0-0 and run", and we did. Last season we'd have lost that game by at least a couple.

[Exile]

I am spot on. Platitudes about 'getting an away point' show incredibly low expectations against a football club that has more in common with Chasetown FC than the Saddlers. This time last year we were rightly sharing our disappointment at PM's close season signings. I truly believe that, Constable apart, PM has weakened the squad that was relegated from the Championship. It's been a long time since Wrack performed well but if he's made any sort of recovery he'll add more to the team than Paul Smith, Broad or Barrowman's contributions combined. Giving blind adulation to everything PM does simply because of who he is not is as ridiculous as the praise heaped Sven for not losing against tiny footballing nations in qualifying games.

You are a wind-up. Brilliant stuff.

Love it Exile - nice piece of editing!!!!

Glad someone read it!

[dler]

A very disappointing performance. Chester were, like most teams we have faced this season, absolutely dire, but they were by far the better team.

I cannot understand those who like Dobson - he was his usual rubbish - not in the game much, giving the ball away, creating nothing. Bedeau can go now into non league football where he belongs.

We went 90 minutes without us having a single chance.

Good points are that we defended well enough to keep Chester out, and Bossu did everything asked of him.

The only time we were in the game was at the start of the second half. Whether this was because it took Chester 15 minutes to work out how to deal with the wind in their faces, or because for a time we had 5 in midfield I am not sure. When DD made the mistake of putting Dann on as centre forward we reverted to rubbish. Just because Dann has scored a couple of goals it does not mean that he can play as a centre forward. Please don't repeat that mistake DD - he is a good defender, but no forward.

Not only was the game completely without excitement or interest, but the pies cost £2.40 and £1.70 for a bottle of pop.

Careful Bernie - the majority here would burn you at the stake, just because we're not as crap as we were last season. I, for one, agree that we are pretty poor in a division that is pish poor. If we were one division higher I suspect we would be struggling to stay up.

[Bernie]

Careful Bernie - the majority here would burn you at the stake, just because we're not as crap as we were last season. I, for one, agree that we are pretty poor in a division that is pish poor. If we were one division higher I suspect we would be struggling to stay up.

Thank you for that.

In our last four matches we have played three away and one at home, won 2 and drawn 2, including the 4-0 win against Mansfield. Those are certainly the sort of results that will give us promotion. So all Walsall fans will be very happy with the results and any fans who did not attend the matches will not understand any criticism.

Unfortunately for those who have been at those four matches know that in the 4 matches we only actually played well for the 45 minutes in the second half against Mansfield. The other 315 minutes have been awful. And I mean awful, not just average but - despite the very good results - really poor. We have not played anything approaching football in seven eighths of our last four matches.

I suppose that as a Walsall fan you have to be an optimist so I hope that we will get through this patch of rubbish and begin to play well and show that we deserve to be at the top of the division.

[Exile]

Bernie / 'dler - I recall some comments made last season regarding the relative parity of the bottom two leagues. It's a whole debate in itself, but given that nobody's come on here to moan lately, and the thread's only been saved by futuresobrights random contribution, we ought to pad it out a bit.

Are we sure that League One and League Two are that different? I reckon our side would be a banker for at least mid-table mediocrity in the next one up, and could be better than that. Are we head and shoulders above the rest on here though? Better, yes, but that much?

[4143]

We're due a loss - a draw would be taken by me at this stage.

One day in the distant future you may wish to consider putting us down for the win.

Or are you still in therapy over the cactus incident?

I'd have made myself look a right gimp had I have put down a win, wouldn't I?

Although I do conceed, we have the benefit of hindsight 8)

[latviancheese]

Careful Bernie - the majority here would burn you at the stake, just because we're not as crap as we were last season. I, for one, agree that we are pretty poor in a division that is pish poor. If we were one division higher I suspect we would be struggling to stay up.

Thank you for that.

In our last four matches we have played three away and one at home, won 2 and drawn 2, including the 4-0 win against Mansfield. Those are certainly the sort of results that will give us promotion. So all Walsall fans will be very happy with the results and any fans who did not attend the matches will not understand any criticism.

Unfortunately for those who have been at those four matches know that in the 4 matches we only actually played well for the 45 minutes in the second half against Mansfield. The other 315 minutes have been awful. And I mean awful, not just average but - despite the very good results - really poor. We have not played anything approaching football in seven eighths of our last four matches.

I suppose that as a Walsall fan you have to be an optimist so I hope that we will get through this patch of rubbish and begin to play well and show that we deserve to be at the top of the division.

How can people complain, people seem to think we should walk the league, and by rights we should. But its not gonna be that easy. We're not exaclty a premiership team.

[Cully]

How can people complain, people seem to think we should walk the league, and by rights we should. But its not gonna be that easy. We're not exaclty a premiership team.

Not sure what you and others been reading on this thread, I thought it was for opinion/comments on the match and reporting regarding the performance of the team, tactics and players. So far we seem to have had a couple of lectures :roll: about how we should be reacting to the result on Friday night along with the usual 4th division cliche comments about the criteria for getting promoted which we all know and accept.
There is no doubt that the majority of posters on this board have a realistic view and moderate expectation of our chances of promotion this season after the disasterous Merscum period, we have made a fantastic start under DD and long may it continue but please don't read words into anyones posts that are simply not there.

I can't see anything wrong with posters saying how we performed, I hope that we play well for the remainder of the season but just in case we don't I hereby give notice that I reserve the right to post the facts.

[merse-iah's disciple]

I can't see anything wrong with posters saying how we performed, I hope that we play well for the remainder of the season but just in case we don't I hereby give notice that I reserve the right to post the facts.

Exactly Cul-meister. The big picture is that we should be promoted this season and we are on the right path to doing this. BUT if we haven't performed well then, of course, posters on here have a right to point this out.

Over the last few seasons the opposite happened, whereby we were playing like a pub team on a Sunday knockabout after a night on the beers (a bit too close to the truth....!), but we had the occasional good performance, although we pointed out it was a good one - we didn't loose sight of the fact that overall we were pants.

[Kiansmom]

I'd love to meet Steve Madley who writes for the E & S and watch a game through his glasses! he obviously watches a totally different game to me. His player watch for the Chester game was laughable.

I thought we had a poor game, but anyone who thinks we are going to score 4/5 goals every week will be disapponted. Happy to take the point it's a point closer to promotion.

[m&m]

It is disappointing to witness such dire football however I think DD has set out his stall correctly --in the words of the Hard-Fi track we run out to --HARD TO BEAT.In this division it won't be pretty but we have one goal and that's promotion from this graveyard.Let's not forget that.

[Duke]

HARD TO BEAT.In this division it won't be pretty but we have one goal and that's promotion from this graveyard.Let's not forget that.

Spot on

[geoffwhiting]

This result needs to be put into perspective.

Friday night the weather was against decent football, no doubt about it, so a poor performance was hardly a great surprise. Add to that we were playing away in a tiny ground with little real atmosphere, against a side that wanted to "have one over" the team sitting at the top of the league, and the scene is set.

They nearly scored - ONCE - when Bossu made A - thats ONE - great save, we took a point and another clean sheet, while failing to score in a game for the first time this season.

We have 28 points from 13 games and a vastly better goal difference than ANYONE else in this division. If we keep up this average we'll end up on 99 points and that's certain promotion.

Can't we be a little less scathing, Friday was a draw, not the end of the world.

[Duke]

This result needs to be put into perspective.

Friday night the weather was against decent football, no doubt about it, so a poor performance was hardly a great surprise. Add to that we were playing away in a tiny ground with little real atmosphere, against a side that wanted to "have one over" the team sitting at the top of the league, and the scene is set.

They nearly scored - ONCE - when Bossu made A - thats ONE - great save, we took a point and another clean sheet, while failing to score in a game for the first time this season.

We have 28 points from 13 games and a vastly better goal difference than ANYONE else in this division. If we keep up this average we'll end up on 99 points and that's certain promotion.

Can't we be a little less scathing, Friday was a draw, not the end of the world.

very well said geoff , how many of us would have settled for a draw before kick off . I for one certainly would.

[NEWPORT SADDLERS DAD]

I was dissapointed as the weather seemed to give Chester a big advantage in the first half,I thought we would
take them apart in the second half and we couldn't.Still win home games draw away games and were up.

[Magic Man Fan]

I'm becoming increasingly bored and tired of reading the match threads.

Poor performance. 1 away point. Over 1000 supporters. The promotion band wagon rolls on.

[We-ARE-Walsall]

Top of the League , teams want to beat us, we are having to dig in, and dig in hard for these away points, would be nice to turn them into wins, i am sure it will come

Just a quick point, just in case Future so Bright pops in for a look

Would we have come away from that game, or Shrewsbury, with anything at all ?

Anyone with a head on their shoulders would have to answer honestly and say no

[philthesaddler]

I think the wind played a big part. Chester are used to the wind - that ground is very exposed and the team are obviously used to that, they used the wind to their advantage, especially the second half. We just didn't turn up. Mark Wright, im afraid too say, couldn't cope with the wind, but I suppose thats what happens when you only weight 4 stone. :lol:

Nah, but seriously, we never really got the ball down, and under any control, really just hoofed it, thats why Wrighty never really saw the ball in the first half, and Ish in the second.

Yes i'd have taken a point, but we were very lucky not to have lost that, and that would have put a completely different complexion on the game.

We are easily good enough to beat teams like Chester, even on their own patch, we just have to learn how we play well - i.e when we get the ball down, pass and move, pass and move, knock it out to the wings and swing one in... on Friday it was a matter of Keates or Dobson just putting their boot through the ball. If we start going away from home, and start playing our game, and not let the opposition have any time to control the game, we'll start performing better, but as long as we go away and play this 'scared' booting the ball up the field football we wont get any decent away performances.

[Geordiesaddler]

I can't honestly believe prople think this team and manager would struggle in the division above, we have already won away at Plymouth and pushed premiership Bolton to the brink of a draw. There isn't a shread or evidence to suggest that this team would struggle against a slightly better class of opposition. Even under Merscum we bobbed around in mid-table until the sale of Fryatt and Jorge. People just don't seem to get that being well organised and difficult to beat is 3/4 or the battle to being successful - look at the Graydon runner-up team, or the promotion team that Nichol built. Add a natural goalscorer to a well drilled, solid line-up and you will win more than lose, we have one in Martin Butler, and I'm extremely confident that Nicholls rehab will be another telling positive this season as he will add pace and natural goal-scoring ability to our attacking options.

Have a moan about poor performances to your hearts content if that's what turns you on so but I can remember how counter-productive such moaning was under Lee and the consequenses of it, personally I find such moaning nausiating when I pick up the paper and see us two points clear at the top of the league with a mouth-watering top of the table clash looming next week. Bernie said two weeks ago that if we carried on playing as we did against Bristol Rovers and Shrewsbury we would finish in the bottom half of the league - well hey by his own admission we have played exactly the same (save for 45 minutes against Mansfield) and two games later we are 4 points, and 4 goals better off having kept 2 further clean sheets, and are still top of the league. This didn't stop some people booing us off at half-time against Mansfield which is laughable.

On the whole teams promoted from this league tend to do pretty well, Southend went straight through last season, Swansea made the play-offs, Scunthorpe are currently third top, Yeovil fifth, of the teams promoted last season only Leyton Orient are showing obvious signs of a quick return to the basement division.

[Magic Man Fan]

I can't honestly believe prople think this team and manager would struggle in the division above

Unbelievable isn't it?

But for me it is completely irrelevant. Who gives a cack whether we would be winning in the division above? We're not in the division above. Worry about that when we get there and not before.

[Bernie]

Have a moan about poor performances to your hearts content if that's what turns you on so but I can remember how counter-productive such moaning was under Lee and the consequenses of it, .

What do you mean by counter-productive? Are you saying that what is written on here has an effect on the team? Do you believe that if we criticise the team that is somehow going to make them play worse? Can you explain? Exactly how did people moaning on this board about Lee have any consequences? Are you saying that Bonser sacked Lee because of things written on this board?

Perhaps that is behind all this "stop moaning and get behind the lads" rubbish. This is just a messageboard for people to write what they want about all things WFC. Nothing we write on here is going to be counter-productive or even productive. It is just words, opinions, hot air. No reason to get all cranky about it.

[Geordiesaddler]

Not getting cranky about it Bernie, I just wish people would show a bit more intelligence. Its not so much the moaning on here but the booing and moaning at games which is surely counter-productive?? For example at the Mansfield game it would have been nice if poeple had shown a little bit of faith in the manager's proven ability to make positive changes to an underperforming team rather then just the brain-dead, knee-jerk reaction that occured that was frankly, embarrassing. We are top of the league and yet there have been several occasions this season when individual players have been singled out for booing and abuse - Westwood for example. To turn your argument around can you explain how this constitutes "supporting" your team? I find it doubly incredible when I think back to the remarkable tolerance that was shown to the previous "manager". Yes moan all you like as I say, but when people start to draw predictions and conclusions from their depressive state of mind about a particular match then I think its fair to challenge and debate those opinions.

I the last couple of weeks we've had your assertion that if we carry on playing like we were we would finish in the bottom half of the league, and now people saying we would struggle in the division above. As MMF says what relevance has this? What I'm saying is ok, that's your opinion give me some evidence to support it. Thus far we've had neither, and instead just the usual bleatings about "this is a message board and I'll say what I want blah blah" Yeah fine to which I add "post your opinions on a public message board and the liklihood is someone will disagree with them and challenge what you say".

I at least attempt to back up my opinion with evidence, so what evidence do we have to suggest that we will a) Finish in the bottom half of this league, or b) struggle in the division above??

I know one thing for sure the same people that are moaning now will be straight on here having some kind of epilleptic "I told you so" fit the minute e lose a game - which we will - that's football, but my view is we can afford to lose about 10 games, so as long as we are on target not to be any worse than that our promotion ambitions are not seriously threatened. At present I can't see where more than 10 defeats are coming from directly as a result of the way DD has set the team up to be hard to beat.

As I said on this thread the other day there are "pretty teams" like Lincoln and Wycombe in this division, who knows Wtcombe might play us off the park on Saturday as Lincoln did for an hour at their place. But I can tell you this after 30 odd years of watching it, pretty teams rarely win promotion in the lower division, they have a tendancy to get found out and run out of steam, just as Lincoln did against us, just as Wycombe did last season, its the solid, sometimes, boring "do just enough" type teams that get the rewards.

One other point DD has not had a full squad to pick from yet, on Friday there were 5 players missing including our keeper and three centre-forwards (Ok Sam was on the bench I think but he wasn't fit). Is there not genuine cause for optimism that when everyone is fit we will do even better than we have - and we are currently top of the league!!

[Magic Man Fan]

I'm all for complaining (:D you should know by now :D) but only when there is cause. I really don't see a cause at the moment.

You may remember I was critical after Barnet and Grimsby because we weren't playing well. To be honest I don't think we've improved much since then and yes there is certainly a margin for improvment. However performances only matter when results don't go your way and I've since decided that the division is that poor that we seem to able to play below par and still not lose.

If we lose or fail to beat MK Dons and Wycombe then things might be different and I would like to see how we react to a couple of losses but we'll wait until that happens.

Otherwise we are top, have remained top and as long as we don't lose too many (only one so far) then we will stay there or thereabouts and possibly improve when Wrack, Nicholls are fully fit and in the squad because Sam and Bedeau aren't up to it unless someone puts pressure on them.