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Stockport (H) League - Tuesday 08/08/2006

Reports and reaction from the 2006-07 season as Walsall finished 1st (C) in League 2
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WFC_Rob
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Tue Aug 08, 2006 10:55 pm

Brum wrote:
WFC_Rob wrote:
Brum wrote:it's no coincidence lots of managers have picked him again and again.

It's also no coincidence we conceded so many goals down our right side last year. :roll:


back that up with some stats then...

Why bother - I've seen enough of him to realise that he is an average league 2 player at best having attended at least 30 matches last year.
How about you find me some stats which prove that his inclusion in the side benefits the team?
Doesn't tackle, doesn't mark his man, gives the ball away so cheaply it's criminal Ocassionally he runs with the ball and beats his man, but there's rarely an end product. He looks better now than he did last year because we are now playing in the fourth tier of English league football.
Last edited by WFC_Rob on Tue Aug 08, 2006 10:59 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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coxy_saddler
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Tue Aug 08, 2006 10:58 pm

Rob_Walsall wrote:
coxy_saddler wrote:
PerStener wrote:
coxy_saddler wrote:Great Once again

That's all i am at the moment > :D


Before the match :)
When SaddlersWorld didnt work: :evil:
when Butler scored: :D
When Roper scored: :shock:

Now :lol: :lol: :lol:

When roper scored it was bloody great!
Just shows what we are in for this season :lol:


me jumpin on ya lol

Yea, you neally bloody killed me when roper scored that! :shock:

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1933
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Tue Aug 08, 2006 10:58 pm

WFC_Rob wrote:
Brum wrote:
WFC_Rob wrote:
Brum wrote:it's no coincidence lots of managers have picked him again and again.

It's also no coincidence we conceded so many goals down our right side last year. :roll:


back that up with some stats then...

Why bother - I've seen enough of him to realise that he is an average league 2 player at best having attended at least 30 matches last year. Doesn't tackle, doesn't mark his man, gives the ball away so cheaply it's criminal Ocassionally he runs with the ball and beats his man, but there's rarely an end product. He looks better now than he did last year because we are now playing in the fourth tier of English league football.


great team performance by all of the players tonight, and you've decided to highlight Wright for errors he made last season....

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Neuromantic
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Tue Aug 08, 2006 10:59 pm

Mark Wright = lots of good runs + no end product = frustrating / no strength - bottler = very frustrating

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Brum
 
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Tue Aug 08, 2006 10:59 pm

you just don't like him. you can't blame him for goals conceded last year. he's a winger, not a full back (and don't talk crap about wingers covering their full backs. blame the fitness/organisation/management of last year's team, rather than your least favourite player). he had a good game today, lot's of people will agree. 'wright's rubbish' is boring. he gets stick when he's poor, he should get credit when he plays well. today he did, even the stockport commentators praised him, according to the other thread. :evil:

Harold Bishop
 

Tue Aug 08, 2006 11:01 pm

G'day

Wish people would give Mark Wright a chance, people alway seem to have a go at him week in week out . Even when he has a good game people still moan
Last edited by Harold Bishop on Tue Aug 08, 2006 11:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Tue Aug 08, 2006 11:03 pm

lol :roll:

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WFC_Rob
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Tue Aug 08, 2006 11:04 pm

1933 wrote:great team performance by all of the players tonight, and you've decided to highlight Wright for errors he made last season....

I've decided to highlight Wright because I think he offers us very little. What he did last season bears little relevance at this moment in time, but seeing as he's only played twice this season, a fairer reflection on his performances can be taken from last season.
For the record, I've never given Wright anything but applause and cheers. Just thought I'd set that straight before people start accusing me of being a reason for any excuse such as a lack of confidence.

London Saddler
 

Tue Aug 08, 2006 11:09 pm

Cracking game and in the end, a rather comfortable win

Stockport like Rochdale worked hard but were totally outclassed. Like Rochdale, they narrowly avoided relegation to non league football last season and again like Rochdale, have started this season with defeats in both their games and no goals scored. Any team who wants to go up automatically has to beat the likes of them and we have. Job well done

Defensively Ropes came in for Picken. Ince didnt drop any clangers and made a wonderful save in the 2nd half. But he did sometimes make a meal of saving some simple shots and his kicking was poor. Ropes was Ropes. Won 99% of the headers, won 99% of the tackles and was immense. My MOM. Gerrard brilliant and thankfully back to his best. Kris Taylor surprised me as he was very solid at left back and looked far better than Fox has ever looked there. Pead gave 100% as he usually does, but still nearly dropped a couple of clangers in 1st half which nearly let in Stockport. We know he hasnt got the physical strength or pace but this will probably be less of an issue at this level. However i still feel Westwood is a better bet at right back. Stockport created 2-3 good chances in the game but it was due to some of our mistakes in the 1st half and sitting too deep in 2nd half. Why do we bring back all 11 players when the opposition have a corner or set piece near our box? Our defense cleared well each time but because no one was up, the ball returned quicky a few times

In midfield, we controlled most of the game. Where did we get Dobson from? Excellent. Forget issued about captain now. He will be captain for rest of season. Kinsella did his job efficiently and without fuss. Wright in my opinion was excellent. Threatening every time he got the ball and like Rochdale, the Stockport players looked scared stiff every time he ran at them. Ok he is not perfect, but now with Money in charge, i think there is a lot more to come from him. Fox tried hard (more than he managed to do last season) but was very limted. He struggles in his natural position of left back let alone in midfield. Bristol made an excellent point after Rochdale game. If u are going to play 2 defensive midfielders in Dobson and Kinsella, and then play a left back on left wing, u r going to make the midfield solid but also that means that any pace or creativity is going to have to come from Wrighty alone which is a lot of pressure on him. Happened again today, whenever Wrighty got ball we looked threatening, when it was on left midfield we didn't. Better teams may not be so easy to break down hence i feel the Demon is a better bet at left wing. So far from what i have seen, teams at this level struggle badly against any pace

Up front we ran them ragged. Little to say on Butler. He scored again and had loads of chances. He held the ball up and generally was a class apart. Denied a blatant penaulty in 1st half when referee bottled out as Butler was thro and Stockport player should have been sent off for professional foul. If he stays fit, he will score 25 goals this season. But Butler can't score all the goals himself. Sam looked strong, linked up well and gave the Stockport back 4 a torrid night. But he never looked like scoring. He or the 2nd striker are going to have to chip in with at least 10-15 goals if we r going to go up, as i cant see too many goals from midfield. We had loads of chances today and on another day could easily have won by 5 or 6. Constable probably won't look so strong on the ball or play link up football so well as Sam, but Constable does look more of a natural goalscorer so Money has nice choices to make

It is important to note that above is just nit picking and observations, not criticism as i am chuffed to bits and felt at times we ripped Stockport to shreds. We looked hungry, fit and committed and played some great football. Was impressed with substitutions, as they replaced tiring players with fresh legs, in right position and at right time. Atmosphere was great today. Hartlepool (who havn't managed a goal yet) come to Bescot on Saturday, but frankly who ever we play, if we perform like we did tonight and against Rochdale, we will win

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1933
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Tue Aug 08, 2006 11:12 pm

WFC_Rob wrote:
1933 wrote:great team performance by all of the players tonight, and you've decided to highlight Wright for errors he made last season....

I've decided to highlight Wright because I think he offers us very little. What he did last season bears little relevance at this moment in time, but seeing as he's only played twice this season, a fairer reflection on his performances can be taken from last season.
For the record, I've never given Wright anything but applause and cheers. Just thought I'd set that straight before people start accusing me of being a reason for any excuse such as a lack of confidence.


Fair enough - but I think his crosses, particulary in the first half, did offer us alot.

Rob it would be boring if we all agreed about everything wouldn't it! :wink:

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Tue Aug 08, 2006 11:12 pm

coxy_saddler wrote:
Rob_Walsall wrote:
coxy_saddler wrote:
PerStener wrote:
coxy_saddler wrote:Great Once again

That's all i am at the moment > :D


Before the match :)
When SaddlersWorld didnt work: :evil:
when Butler scored: :D
When Roper scored: :shock:

Now :lol: :lol: :lol:

When roper scored it was bloody great!
Just shows what we are in for this season :lol:


me jumpin on ya lol

Yea, you neally bloody killed me when roper scored that! :shock:


o well, more of the same on Saturday :lol:

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coxy_saddler
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Tue Aug 08, 2006 11:17 pm

Rob_Walsall wrote:
coxy_saddler wrote:
Rob_Walsall wrote:
coxy_saddler wrote:
PerStener wrote:
coxy_saddler wrote:Great Once again

That's all i am at the moment > :D


Before the match :)
When SaddlersWorld didnt work: :evil:
when Butler scored: :D
When Roper scored: :shock:

Now :lol: :lol: :lol:

When roper scored it was bloody great!
Just shows what we are in for this season :lol:


me jumpin on ya lol

Yea, you neally bloody killed me when roper scored that! :shock:


o well, more of the same on Saturday :lol:

Yeah, My turn to break your neck this time! :lol:

Harold Bishop
 

Tue Aug 08, 2006 11:20 pm

G'day

Me and Lou try to break each others backs when we wrestle in Lou's Place after a few Peach snaps

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Tue Aug 08, 2006 11:44 pm

Cannot compute...

Forwards win balls in the air
Opposition players get marked when we're defending set pieces
Wingers cover back when full backs go forward
Goalkeeper gets through whole game without making obscene gestures towards his own fans

I feel like I've been missing out, all these years!

Another good, professional performance tonight, but with the same note of caution as the weekend - Stockport were not very good. At all. Nice to see them trying to play football instead of hoofing it, but they still weren't very good. Still - you can only beat the team you're playing, and we did (entirely comfortably). Ince only had one save to make and he made it well, he commanded his area the rest of the time; nothing was getting past Gerrard and particulalry the outstanding Roper, the clear man of the match; I swear I saw Mark Wright take on his defender AND beat him AND plant the ball on our forward's head, on more than one occasion; and Martin Butler is going to score absolutely bucketloads if he stays fit, he's just a class apart from anyone else.

Feeling very happy!

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Wed Aug 09, 2006 12:15 am

Sam almost scored with his overhead kick to the crossbar. Couldn't get closer without it being a goal.

To inject some reality, Stockport were very poor. Wright started well as he had acres of space around their very narrow 433, and when they switched to 442 he was dealt with more effectively. Can't take anything away from his performance, as listening to the Stockport commentary (Saddlersworld failed again - what a surprise) they really thought highly of him and wished they had someone like that.

Stockport also had no capable attacking wide men to support their holding central midfield, and that told as nearly all their crosses from the flanks were to dead space, our defenders or too close to Incey-Wincey keeper to be a danger. It was also a relief that Bramble wasn't playing for them.

Still, 2-0 is 3 more points in the bag - just what we need.

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Wed Aug 09, 2006 12:25 am

Sounds like another decent performance, overall. Saturday should be our first real test, lets see how we cope against a better class of oppostition.

just wanted to say thanks to London Saddler for such a great post. As i can't get to the games at the moment, its great to be able to read such a well balanced, detailed post about the game.

Anyway, so far so good. Lets hope Dobson is back in action asap

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geoffwhiting
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Wed Aug 09, 2006 12:35 am

Wright had a very good game tonight, anyone on his back tonight is well out of order and, frankly, just blinkered. Someone above says he is at best a League 2 player - well if that's true, that's fine, because if you look you'll note that League 2 is exactly where we are! And he definitely did the business tonight, so for Christ's sake, give him some credit for once!

Dobson was superb, to criticise him tonight is ludicrous. MoM was between him and Ropes, it's a hard call.

Definite penalty on Butler, we also hit the bar twice, and the Stockport keeper made several good instinctive (maybe fortunate) saves, so this could have been a much bigger victory, which woud not have flattered us.

Great game to watch and I thought Stockport are to be praised for playing a full part - Dickinson up front, particularly, caught my eye, and he WILL get goals against lesser defences than ours. Goalie did well too, of course.

I hope, but doubt, that Dobson will be available Saturday, and if he's not it will be a massive blow, but I think we now have the strength in depth to cope.

Oh, and Butler, Gerrard and Kris Taylor were excellent, but to be honest, who wasn't ??

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Wed Aug 09, 2006 12:45 am

We are set up not conceed goals, we have a natural goalscorer in Butler, a genuine threat from set peices, and are playing in a league where most teams arn't averse to handing us the odd goal on a stick. Therefore I expect many more results like the last two. Sure there will be the odd defeat along the way, and maybe the odd bad couple of weeks. But the most absurd set of injuries since Chernobyl permitting I am convinced we will finish bare minimum top 5 in this league. Especially now we have got off to a flyer which I doubted we would.

Wrack, Nicholls, and Bedeau yet to feature, Money not yet even dabbling in the loan market? Picken not even on the bench last night. We have a strength in depth that many can only dream of. Early days, but what a genuinely great start.

Oh and well done Clayton Ince - 2 clean sheets and a start on the way to his record he set at Crewe, what was it 21 in a season or something?

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Wed Aug 09, 2006 2:14 am

Fantastic result. The thing i am most pleased about is the second nil against in two games. Shows we are good and strong at the back.

The only thing that worries me slightly is the fact that on August 9 last year we were celebrating the fact of two games and six points after an away win at Rotherham on the Saturday and a home win against Notts Forest on the Tuesday.

But last year we were a very pretty sandcastle at this stage which looked great but in hindsight had no foundations. All evidence suggests that this year the foundations are there and as solid as they can possibly be.

Onwards and upwards :D

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Wed Aug 09, 2006 3:57 am

My main concern is the amount of pocesssion Stockport had particulary in the second half, having said that i could'nt see them scoring . Also a times we gave the ball away cheaply, better teams is this league will punnish us for that.

I'm not a big Mark Wright fan , but last night he looked a totally different and better player ,playng with more confidence. Michael Dobson was outstanding what a signing hardly wasted a ball i'll feel a lot better when i know he's ok. Both Butler and Roper took their goals well .

What really capped the night for me was meeting Grace , those of you yet to meet her are in for a treat , she's a lovely girl.

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Wed Aug 09, 2006 4:57 am

Deathguise wrote:Am I the only one that thought Dobson was distinctly average today? He improved a lot in the second half but I couldn't believe it when he was named MotM.

He gave the ball away far too many times and gave quite a few bad passes which put us in danger.

Wright looked decent for about 10 minutes at hte beginning, but was bloody awful after that. I was impressed by out left side, although not quite a strong attacking threat, Taylor and Fox looked very comfortable and Solid.



You must have been watching a very different Michael Dobson than me,
He was outstanding the kind of player we have lacked for years.
Agreed about Taylor and Fox though very solid

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bigste
 
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Wed Aug 09, 2006 5:21 am

Deathguise wrote:Am I the only one that thought Dobson was distinctly average today? He improved a lot in the second half but I couldn't believe it when he was named MotM.

He gave the ball away far too many times and gave quite a few bad passes which put us in danger.

Wright looked decent for about 10 minutes at hte beginning, but was bloody awful after that. I was impressed by out left side, although not quite a strong attacking threat, Taylor and Fox looked very comfortable and Solid.


Are you on some kind of medication ??? What game were you watching??
Dobson never put a foot wrong all night.
*******************
Dicky dosh is the new gabby buckran, milking the crowd at the end of the game. Now at least it shows passion, and belief, not like a previous clown of a manager.
Cracking game, 6 points, 2 clean sheets that breeds confidence.

COME ON YOU SADDLERS!!!

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Wed Aug 09, 2006 6:29 am


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shrewsbury saddler
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Wed Aug 09, 2006 6:49 am

Geordiesaddler wrote:We are set up not conceed goals, we have a natural goalscorer in Butler, a genuine threat from set peices, and are playing in a league where most teams arn't averse to handing us the odd goal on a stick. Therefore I expect many more results like the last two. Sure there will be the odd defeat along the way, and maybe the odd bad couple of weeks. But the most absurd set of injuries since Chernobyl permitting I am convinced we will finish bare minimum top 5 in this league. Especially now we have got off to a flyer which I doubted we would.

Wrack, Nicholls, and Bedeau yet to feature, Money not yet even dabbling in the loan market? Picken not even on the bench last night. We have a strength in depth that many can only dream of. Early days, but what a genuinely great start.

Oh and well done Clayton Ince - 2 clean sheets and a start on the way to his record he set at Crewe, what was it 21 in a season or something?

The way we keep our shape when we haven't got the ball and refuse to allow space to the oppostion when they have the ball should be paricularly suited to playing away.Isee a lot of 0-1 smash and grab raids coming up-like Graydon's first season,and,after last night,i'm pretty confident of the same end result.

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Wed Aug 09, 2006 7:17 am

shrewsbury saddler wrote:Did anyone else notice the record they played at the end?"Bringing on back the good times".that's just what it felt like to me.for the first time in ages i've got home from a match and thought "Yes,that was worth going to see".


Since you went away I've been losing my sleep at night
Never thought there'd come a day
when you'd be back to make everything right,
but how wrong could I be, 'Cos now you're here with me

Bringing on back the good times,
taking away the pain.
You're bringing on back the good times
and I'm living on air,
So glad that you're there,
sweeping away the sad times,
making me laugh again
Oh you're Bringing on back the good times
And you've started me livin',
now that I'm lovin' again

I've never been loved by anybody that's quite like you,
So when you're telling me of
all the things you want me to do,
now you've made me see
what you mean to me

You're bringing on back the good times
Taking away the pain
You're bringing on back the good times
and I'm living on air,
So glad that you're there,
sweeping away the sad times,
making me laugh again
Yes you're Bringing on back the good times
And you've started me livin',
now that I'm lovin' again

You're bringing on back the good times
Taking away the pain
You're bringing on back the good times
and I'm living on air,
So glad that you're there,
sweeping away the sad times,
making me laugh again
Oh you're Bringing on back the good times
And you've started me livin',
now that I'm lovin' again

Oh you're bringing on back the good times
and I'm living on air,
So glad that you're there,
sweeping away the sad times,
making me laugh again
Oh you're Bringing on back the good times



I think the lyrics sum up just about what we all felt after the last couple of performances. As people are saying: We've got our Walsall back again.

The Uttoxeter Saddler
 

Wed Aug 09, 2006 7:56 am

Exile wrote:To inject some reality


Have you got to? Much rather be on the crest of an over-optimistic wave!

philthesaddler
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Wed Aug 09, 2006 8:26 am

Well, what a great performance.

Should really have been 4 or 5, Butler should have had a hat trick, but I aint going to complain, we are 3rd and haven't conceded a goal.

I thought we set the tone in the first 10 minutes when we kept the ball imperiously - Don't think Stockport had a touch for 10 minutes did they? Every body playing well, being patient, keeping the ball and eventually creating a chance.

How on earth the referee didn't give the penalty is beyond me. Fair enough, in your first league game you might bottle a difficult decision, one thats a bit ambiguous, but thats probably the most stonewall penalty I've ever seen, Butler had no reason to go down, the defender clearly got no where near the ball - penalty and sending off, but no. That kind of decision should mean he drops out of football league refereeing, because when it comes down to it, thats a match changing decision, and he effed up. I thought the ref poor all round to be honest.

Clayton Ince, at time his kicking was a bit off, but mainly solid, and again a good couple of saves. Gerrard and Roper, absolutely superb. Pead and Taylor, excellent.

Mark Wright, his play on the ball has improved dramatically. His use of the ball when he has it is dangerous and worries defenders, that what he's there to do. He's growing in confidence and starts to take players on, which is great to see. However, his off the ball play is at times way way way below standard - he's drifts in to a daze the minute he's passed the ball, he rarely uses his pace to make runs - at times there were acres of space crying for him to run in to, but he just jogs on out wide. His tackling and heading need to improve, and he needs to stop dozing when he hasnt got the ball. And also, he needs to set off quicker. For a guy with his pace, he don't half take his time to get going, and that gives defenders the chance to pick him up. But all round, a good performance by Wright, very encouraging.

Kinsella, did well, could probably do with some younger legs in that position, but he seems a different player to the one we saw under Merson, so he's sound in my book.

Dobson, well what can I say. Imperious, majestic... That Carlos Alberto step over was a masterstroke. What a superb player he is.

Fox, IMHO the poorest Walsall player last night. He looked off the pace, like Wright a little dozy at times, and reluctant to get forward. That game was crying out for ish to start on the left.

Butler and Sam. Superb, absolutely superb. I was saying to Daz at half time what a difference, what a breath of fresh air it is to see proper strikers, not the tripe of the likes of Barrowman, Robinson, Birch, Fitzgerald, Deon Burton and Larossa. It just goes to show what I've been saying for years, you pay peanuts, you get monkeys. In Sam and Butler we've got two strikers who, in the not so distant past, have been regarded so highly that clubs have parted with £100k+ for their services - we got them through a bit of luck, and some very shrewd trasfer market watching by RM. It's such a massive difference to have strikers that know what strikers should be doing, interchanging, flick ons, diagonal runs off the defenders shoulder, in the 6 yard box when crosses come flying in. Its superb to see and a breath of fresh air. Bonser please learn the lesson that for a relatively small investment, you get quality, and this proves it. Just look at the difference between Butler, 32, and Sam, recovering from a broken leg, and the players mentioned above [most of whom are younger than Butler and Sam]

Also, a mention for their goalkeeper. Made 2/3 superb saves - that close range one from Butler and the superb touch he got on keates' lob.

Also a good attendance, so the folk of Walsall will see the light. Hopefully on Saturday we can get close to the 6000 mark, and then no looking back.

UP THE SADDLERS
Last edited by philthesaddler on Wed Aug 09, 2006 8:31 am, edited 4 times in total.

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cal's a saddler
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Wed Aug 09, 2006 8:26 am

That was the first game Ive seen since the end of last season and whilst I have my usual optimism at the start of every new season whilst still thinking the worst could happen! But I cant remember when I enjoyed a game so much! We at last seem to be an organised outfit with players knowing what and where they are supposed to play. In Butler we have a player who runs and chases for everything but in a controlled manner. He seems to have a willing accomplish in Hector Sams too. Dobson brings that bite into midfield and can pass a ball. Still think a decent winger would bring even more success to the upfront pairing but thats me just being pickey!!!

MoM was tight tonight, Personally Id have given it Roper but only coz I like to see him score, but Dobson was in my mind brill!

Really enjoyed the game tonight and just hope we can continue in a similar vein.Well done

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Wed Aug 09, 2006 8:29 am

Quality Preformace... :wink:

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Wed Aug 09, 2006 8:48 am

WFC Rob - Your criticism and hatred towards Mark Wright is becoming tedious. We've heard it all before, if you can't give credit when it is due then don't bother saying anything at all because we know your feelings on him. He played a part in the goal at Rochdale and was very lively and confident tonight beating his man several times and creating chances. I'm not his biggest fan but your criticism is out of order.

Right, moan out of the way. I really enjoyed last night, more than I have a game for ages. Some of the football was excellent we have a front two who complement each other well and I hope Sam notches soon. The way they work together reminds me of Wilson and Lightbourne and look what they did for us in this division.

Dobson was excellent and I can't understand criticism at all. He is very Martin O Connor like, even his telegraphed dummies and turns to get himself some space :) in midfield.

The whole side looks organised, disciplined and worked hard. Fox and Pead looked better than almost all of last season and I was surprised to see Fox even use some skills to take defenders on, I didn't think it was in his game. I also though Kris Taylor was excellent, especially in the first half but I doubt all the people who have written him off will change their opinions like they haven't with Wright.

To all the people (mainly Merson apologists) that were blaming the new stand and other things for poor atmoshpere I think it was clear just how many fans were fed up with the Merson regime as there was a totally different positive atmosphere last night where everyone was prepared to get behind the team.

Roll on Saturday, then the next Saturday etc etc.

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