Bury (h) 21/04/07- Promotion Party Mark II

[Neuromantic]

Well well well...........

I hate to say I told you so, but I told you so. Anthony Gerrard is absolutely Diabolical! I dont feel good feeling like this far from it, but to get slated each week for facts and opinions that are showing to be true, I had to say I TOLD YOU SO.

The first half was as bad as Ive seen all season, but Money must have given them a rollicking at half time. Came out with purpose, but still not good enough.

Ince - didnt really have much to do but his kickign was crap. 6/10

Westwood - Did well defensively but didnt look fully focused. 6/10
Gerrard - Absolutely dreadful positioning and generally awful 1/10
Fox - coped well in the air but still his distribution is infuriating 6/10
KT - switched to centre half and looked ok, tried to play a bit too much tho and got caught out too much. 7/10

Cooper - Few little touches but is never a winger in a million years. 5/10
Dobson - Never got into the game, but what he did, he did well. 6/10
Keates - Again same as Dobson I thought but tried to drive us on, but never had the killer instinct. 7/10
Harper - Tried to pick up the pace and did a few good things but needed better support from the right back. 7/10

Butler - Totally totally off the pace, looked as sharp as a satsuma.
Benjamin - Unlucky to come off instead of Butler, because he can hold it up and got in decent positions. 7/10

Subs:

Ishmel: Best impact performance of him all season, has he reformed ? 9/10 MOTM
Wrack - Didnt do a lot and didnt do a lot wrong. 6/10
Sam - Few nice touches, linked up play better when he was there. 7/10



All in all a game of two halves where we should have scored second half, but the killer finishing eluded us (again).

Thrown the title away.

[philthesaddler]

Well, what a f*cking atrocious performance that was. Stupidly f*cking wasted oppurtunity to go top. I am very angry.

All week Richard Money blabbed on about how we will be gunning for the championship, how we will be playing our strongest side, and what a load of bull that was.

We played a left back at centre back. Not your average left back, Danny Fox, one of the poorest performers this season.

We played an injured left midfielder - Cooper - who just couldn't be arsed.

If we were really going for the title, like money said, why did we play the first half with such a shocking level of complacency? Richard Money didn't need to motivate the players, last nights result should have been enough, but we still shipped in with that tripe in the first half?

And whats all this rubbish about playing the strongest side? If we were playing our strongest side, Mannie Smith would have started because he's actually a centre back, and that would have been much better than Danny Fox drifting around the defence misskicking, missing headers, giving the ball away and losing tackles.

Furthermore, our strongest side would not have Cooper on the left wing who was clearly injured, Ishmel would have started - and should have started.

Don't get me wrong, I don't mind the complacency, what I don't like is the mixed signals we get from the management. On one hand we're being told we're going for the title, so we're going to put in a 'normal' performance, and we'll be playing senior players. On the other hand, we ship in a performance of sh!tness you cant believe - when starting with Deeney, Demontagnac and Smith would have actually improved the side and given us a better chance of winning the gam - it just doesn't make sense --- we were either going to go for it with senior players playing, or chill out and give youngsters a chance.

F*cking disgraceful performance, and once again Deeney is nowhere to be seen even though he scored again in the reserves and with Benjamin looking like a complete lump and Butler looking nackered.

And furthermore the extra fans that turned up today to see us - will they come back? After that performance? No chance.

We had a prime chance to get back on top of the league today. Utterly disgraceful.

[Whitti Steve]

First half was very poor. Second half a bit better - fair play to Bury, they fluked the goal and then put everyone behind the ball and wasted time wherever possible. Make no mistake - the goal was a total fluke - I accept that Gerrard should have decided sooner what he was doing - but he got a good connection to head it away and it just blasted into the oncoming guys face/head - total fluke BUT... I agree Gerrard had a shocker anyway today, as did Fox. No width until Ishy came on - it's been 6 months since I actually wanted him to come on - and fair play, he did really well and gave us an option. Butler and Benjamin were poor today too.

All in all it wasn't what we all expected - BUT, in the grand scheme of things, it's aint the end of the world is it - we are still promoted and still have an outside chance of top spot.

Oh - and I suspect Wrexham next week will be more of the same as an opposition too.

[YGA Saddler]

My dad questioned my downbeat mood, but after last night result and the chance to go top I feel dejected after that performance. OK we are up and will be playing in the same league wherever we finish but for christs sake Walsall for the first time in their lives HAVE SOME AMBITION. We wanted the title. Hartlepool might still lose to Rochdale and we might win meaning we will still be top but does anyone get the impression this was the last chance saloon, because I do!

Onto the game, I thought we were truly dreadful first half, if money said the Notts Co performance was one of the worst, this must surely be the worst. Very few players wanted to win the game and a few already had their minds on their summer holidays.

After this performance I would get the players in tomorrow to train, afterall this is supposed to be a team thats professional and want to win the league.

Truly dreadful

[BEACON SADDLER]

philthesaddler-absolutely spot on summing up,just missed out taylor whose distribution was awful as well

[loop]

Very disappointed with todays performance, we had the perfect opportunity to go top and blew it!!

First half we played poorly and at times looked disinterested, second half much better, ishy helped to pick up the pace but unfortunately we didn't do enough.

:( :( :(

[WFC_Rob]

I'm gutted about today. As some have already suggested, a poor, timid performance after winning promoted is almost expected from time to time, but the attitudes of players and management is hugely disappointing.

I was pleased to hear Money acknowledging our poor performance because there have been times this season, where I think he has given the impression all is rosy, when it has been clear we've struggled. The thing which annoyed me though, and I will quote Money directly here, was his response to the question "The title is still up for grabs though, isn't it?" The reply from our manager was "possibly". No, I don't want to hear 'possibly'. We have 2 games left, and are 3 points behind the leaders who have an inferior goal difference to our own. A little more belief wouldn't go amiss. This must rib off on the players.

Onto the game then. For the first time in a while, nobody had a good game. Certain people just about hit par, but nobody stood up and made it look like we really want the league title.
Ishmel had as good a performance as you'll see from a winger at this level. Full credit to him, because it seems he doesn't have much support from his manager. He was man of the match having played 45 minutes of football. I think the his team mates need to look at that one and start asking themselves questions.

Cooper doesn't want to be here, so we have no reason to waste our time trying to sign him, as I get the impression Money is going to. Benjamin tries harder and actually held the ball up better than he has done so far for us, but he had 2 very good chances to score and didn't take them. The fact that he takes 4 touches to get the ball under control is also frustrating to watch, as it breaks down any momentum we have going forward.

Gerrard is going to get blamed for the winning goal, but I think Clayton Ince needs to be given an equal amount (if not more) of the responsibility for that shambles. Unless Gerrard has eyes in the back of his head, it was up to Ince to tell him what to do with the ball. Ince, being the only man with every player in front of him, left it far too late to try to claim the ball, which was what led to Gerrard heading the ball onto their striker. It was unfortunate, and a very soft goal to give away, but to put your last defender in a situation like that is pure suicide.

I don't like writing posts like this, especially now promotion is in the bag, but as professional sportsmen, I expect the players to want to win everything they can. Today suggested to me that the mentality amongst the players wasn't right, and that's a concern for the future.

[cal wfc fan]

I'm gutted about today. As some have already suggested, a poor, timid performance after winning promoted is almost expected from time to time, but the attitudes of players and management is hugely disappointing.

I was pleased to hear Money acknowledging our poor performance because there have been times this season, where I think he has given the impression all is rosy, when it has been clear we've struggled. The thing which annoyed me though, and I will quote Money directly here, was his response to the question "The title is still up for grabs though, isn't it?" The reply from our manager was "possibly". No, I don't want to hear 'possibly'. We have 2 games left, and are 3 points behind the leaders who have an inferior goal difference to our own. A little more belief wouldn't go amiss. This must rib off on the players.

Onto the game then. For the first time in a while, nobody had a good game. Certain people just about hit par, but nobody stood up and made it look like we really want the league title.
Ishmel had as good a performance as you'll see from a winger at this level. Full credit to him, because it seems he doesn't have much support from his manager. He was man of the match having played 45 minutes of football. I think the his team mates need to look at that one and start asking themselves questions.

Cooper doesn't want to be here, so we have no reason to waste our time trying to sign him, as I get the impression Money is going to. Benjamin tries harder and actually held the ball up better than he has done so far for us, but he had 2 very good chances to score and didn't take them. The fact that he takes 4 touches to get the ball under control is also frustrating to watch, as it breaks down any momentum we have going forward.

Gerrard is going to get blamed for the winning goal, but I think Clayton Ince needs to be given an equal amount (if not more) of the responsibility for that shambles. Unless Gerrard has eyes in the back of his head, it was up to Ince to tell him what to do with the ball. Ince, being the only man with every player in front of him, left it far too late to try to claim the ball, which was what led to Gerrard heading the ball onto their striker. It was unfortunate, and a very soft goal to give away, but to put your last defender in a situation like that is pure suicide.




I don't like writing posts like this, especially now promotion is in the bag, but as professional sportsmen, I expect the players to want to win everything they can. Today suggested to me that the mentality amongst the players wasn't right, and that's a concern for the future.

I dont blame Gerrard at all for that goal. Clayton is an excellant goal keeper, however I do think he sometimes depends on his defenders too much.

[saddlerken]

Gerrard is crap

[Welsh_Saddler]

I get the impression that today's performance was similar to what we might have seen last season under Small Person - would that be an accurate assessment?

I'm in the depths of South Wales, relying on whatever first-hand reports I can get :(

[Zece_WFC]

I get the impression that today's performance was similar to what we might have seen last season under Small Person - would that be an accurate assessment?

I'm in the depths of South Wales, relying on whatever first-hand reports I can get :(

Wasn't far off. :(

[Bernie]

I get the impression that today's performance was similar to what we might have seen last season under Small Person - would that be an accurate assessment?

I'm in the depths of South Wales, relying on whatever first-hand reports I can get :(

If you have seen us in the last six months then you should have a good idea what it was like because the performance was like many others this season except we missed a few good chances.

If a couple of chances had been taken, but the rest of the play been identical, all the usual suspects would be praising a professional performance. Bury were very poor indeed, but they looked at least as good as us with the ball.

[dler]

Oh well, at least the season after next we will have the chance to win this division. :)

[futuresobright]

A slight improvement on last week but yet again a dismal performance. No surprise of course. Any fair minded fan with the capacity for honest reflection will admit that this has been a deeply disappointing season. The players Mr Touchy has brought to our club, Ince and Harper apart, are simply not good enough. Promotion has been built on players he has inherited, particularly Roper and Dann. Undoubtedly Money has organised the defence well, but without the loan of Harper I think it is very unlikely that we would have gained automatic promotion. Today's selections and substitutuions showed Money at his most frustrating...
Fox and Taylor at centre half instead of Smith
Butler instead of Denney
Cooper instead of Ishy
Substituting Benjamin instead of Butler.
To have played 45 league games and not once given Ishy a start, preferring Fox, Taylor, Wrack, Keates, Bedeau, Cooper, Fanguera etc on the left beggars belief. Congratulations to the handful of fans prepared to anger the happy clappers and give Money the criticism he deserved today. Let's have much more next week if he sticks to his perverse selction policy.

[SaigonSaddler]

A slight improvement on last week but yet again a dismal performance. No surprise of course. Any fair minded fan with the capacity for honest reflection will admit that this has been a deeply disappointing season. The players Mr Touchy has brought to our club, Ince and Harper apart, are simply not good enough. Promotion has been built on players he has inherited, particularly Roper and Dann. Undoubtedly Money has organised the defence well, but without the loan of Harper I think it is very unlikely that we would have gained automatic promotion. Today's selections and substitutuions showed Money at his most frustrating...
Fox and Taylor at centre half instead of Smith
Butler instead of Denney
Cooper instead of Ishy
Substituting Benjamin instead of Butler.
To have played 45 league games and not once given Ishy a start, preferring Fox, Taylor, Wrack, Keates, Bedeau, Cooper, Fanguera etc on the left beggars belief. Congratulations to the handful of fans prepared to anger the happy clappers and give Money the criticism he deserved today. Let's have much more next week if he sticks to his perverse selction policy.

What a prat!

Anyway the game was typical of a 1000 other occasions where nerves get in the way of a promotion team getting scuttled by a relegation threatened one. I thought Bury were worth their win.

[Percie]

Gerrard is crap

What that man said!

[boringteacher]

not dissimilar to the performances over the past few weeks. Main difference - the crap referee gave the key decisions against us rather than for us.

Think back to Accrington - was a pen against Butler, but many refs would have said 50/50.
Hereford - did you really think that the last man fouled Benjamin anymore than than Private did to him?
Torquay - weren't there (gulp) but how often do refs give penalties for the minimal contact there was?
Last week - Westwood should have been off with 20 minutes left, but the clown in the middle couldnt see the last man foul that most of us could see from 100 yards further away.

All in all, I'll settle for promotion and that dickhead not spotting a blatant handball/pen/red card from 5 yards away.

God bless DD, good luck to the monkey hangers if they now win the league as they probably deserve to. Maybe I'll actually see us win silver if I support them another 32 years!

my theory on "assistant ref" Amy whatever - they always put her together with rally crap refs just to make her look better. I blame nutter Newell for it.

[Cheesebag]

I may need a tin hat again here but I am starting to agree with a few of Futursobrights points.

Yes we are up and thats Brilliant etc, but we have really "got away" with so many games that would be punished in league one.

Honestly, did we really deserve to be in second with some of the performances? The league table says yes but my heart says no :?

I'm really going to enjoy this promotion but lets not kid ourselves that all will be great in Division 3 unless changes are made.


UP THE SADDLERS

[tinned]

I may need a tin hat again here but I am starting to agree with a few of Futursobrights points.

Yes we are up and thats Brilliant etc, but we have really "got away" with so many games that would be punished in league one.

Honestly, did we really deserve to be in second with some of the performances? The league table says yes but my heart says no :?

I'm really going to enjoy this promotion but lets not kid ourselves that all will be great in Division 3 unless changes are made.


UP THE SADDLERS

Listen to the Cheesemeister, he speaketh sense.

[dinkydotsaddler]

Totally agree with Philthesaddler, futuresobright and WFC Rob, and all the other realists. I went today really wanting to celebrate but found nothing worth celebrating. Yes I know we are promoted and I'm as happy as anyone else that we are, however, we are no better than any other team in that league (IMO), no worse, but no better. What does that say? That for once luck has been on our side overall. That's worth celebrating. Today was appalling and all Money could do on WM afterwards was get all ar$ey about being asked why Ishy hasn't been playing more often. Somthing I would love to hear the answer to. I expected to see a crowd of 7000+ today and was disappointed that we only managed just over 6000, especially as the other Midlands teams were playing. Can't say I blame the people that didn't show.

I can only hope that we manage to do something in the closed season that will give us hope for August. If not it will be a very depressing season. I can honestly say I enjoyed the Walsall v Rotherham game of May 2004 more than todays game. What does that say about today?

I can't believe that there are still some delusional fans out there saying 'look at the table'. What's the matter with these people? Yes we are up but since when has football only been about the results? Where is the enjoyment in watching that cr@p week in week out? As DD said today 'we are in the entertainment business' well I for one haven't been even slightly entertained this season!

[cyclothymic]

I may need a tin hat again here but I am starting to agree with a few of Futursobrights points.

Yes we are up and thats Brilliant etc, but we have really "got away" with so many games that would be punished in league one.

Honestly, did we really deserve to be in second with some of the performances? The league table says yes but my heart says no :?

I'm really going to enjoy this promotion but lets not kid ourselves that all will be great in Division 3 unless changes are made.


UP THE SADDLERS

Sometimes - although he told me a) we would finish 9th and b) we would draw today.

Must try harder :wink:

Listen to the Cheesemeister, he speaketh sense.

[Cheesebag]

I may need a tin hat again here but I am starting to agree with a few of Futursobrights points.

Yes we are up and thats Brilliant etc, but we have really "got away" with so many games that would be punished in league one.

Honestly, did we really deserve to be in second with some of the performances? The league table says yes but my heart says no :?

I'm really going to enjoy this promotion but lets not kid ourselves that all will be great in Division 3 unless changes are made.


UP THE SADDLERS

Sometimes - although he told me a) we would finish 9th and b) we would draw today.

Must try harder :wink:

Listen to the Cheesemeister, he speaketh sense.

I'd have been pleased with a draw after that performance :lol:

[tinned]

Totally agree with Philthesaddler, futuresobright and WFC Rob, and all the other realists. I went today really wanting to celebrate but found nothing worth celebrating. Yes I know we are promoted and I'm as happy as anyone else that we are, however, we are no better than any other team in that league (IMO), no worse, but no better. What does that say? That for once luck has been on our side overall. That's worth celebrating. Today was appalling and all Money could do on WM afterwards was get all ar$ey about being asked why Ishy hasn't been playing more often. Somthing I would love to hear the answer to. I expected to see a crowd of 7000+ today and was disappointed that we only managed just over 6000, especially as the other Midlands teams were playing. Can't say I blame the people that didn't show.

I can only hope that we manage to do something in the closed season that will give us hope for August. If not it will be a very depressing season. I can honestly say I enjoyed the Walsall v Rotherham game of May 2004 more than todays game. What does that say about today?

I can't believe that there are still some delusional fans out there saying 'look at the table'. What's the matter with these people? Yes we are up but since when has football only been about the results? Where is the enjoyment in watching that cr@p week in week out? As DD said today 'we are in the entertainment business' well I for one haven't been even slightly entertained this season!

That's brave of you to so boldly put your head above the parapet. I hope your tin hat is on securely :lol:

Gotta agree with you though. I was sititng there today thinking "How the fudge are we second?". Not a season of exhilirating football was it?

[WFC_Rob]

I can't believe that there are still some delusional fans out there saying 'look at the table'. What's the matter with these people? Yes we are up but since when has football only been about the results? Where is the enjoyment in watching that cr@p week in week out? As DD said today 'we are in the entertainment business' well I for one haven't been even slightly entertained this season!

Decent post, DDS - I find the quoted points quite interesting.
I have to say, by your definition, I am one of those 'delusional' fans. We're at the top because we concede less goals than the other teams and score more goals. Give me success over free-flowing football any day. Look at Tottenham - I think they're probably one of the best teams in the Premiership to watch, but they'll win nothing this season, and probably won't win anthing for a good number of years. I'm sure their fans would rather watch successful ugly football than footbal, which is easy on the eye, but ultimately wins nothing.

DD made me laugh with the comments about us being in 'the entertainment business' because, funnily enough, that's the opposite to what he's been saying all year.

I appreciate what he's done here hugely, but the way we have just decided to settle for what we have has put a downer on recent events (until next week, at least :wink: )

[leics_saddler]

I've broken my own rule about not writing in haste as I'm so angry about today.

I engaged in a short debate with another board member at the end of last week, about what might happen today. Certainly those players who've played the majority of matches deserve to receive the adulation of their fans. However, that does not give them a divine right to play. Perhaps, one might look at it as giving the senior squad a rest and some younger players a chance.

Whoever said 'promotion hangover' was spot on. Never was the phrase used more accurately after today's effort. They really have been on the pop this week. Yes they've earned it, but to turn out and go through the motions today was too much to bear - especially after the result last night. They had a real chance to put the destiny of the championship in their own hands and bottled it - quite literally!

When that well known pop drinker and bank holiday layabout Demontagnac has to come on and liven up the whole affair, we can assume things are bad. He's a brilliant player (at times) but hardly a model professional. However, he's made his senior professionals at the club look like a load pooholes today by being the only one to have the appropriate drive and application to seize the championship instead of the bottle.

Let's hope that there's an appropriate backlash next week, as the only other positive about today is that Boston are closer to amateur football.

[geoffwhiting]

Have to say I agree with most, maybe all, of what philthesaddler has said.

In our position going into the match today, with the title on a silver platter waiting for us, we just failed to turn up at all for 45 minutes. By that time the worst possible scenario had developed :

- a team with escape from the relegation frame on their minds, with their noses in front

versus

- a team desperate to win but finding themselves knocked back and going into panic stations instead of letting the football come through to win us the game.

Result, comedy incidents like :

Benjamin snatching a 3 yard shot amazingly over the crossbar when it MUST have been easier to bust the net than to clear the bar.

Fox cutting into the penalty area and, with players waiting for a lay-off, totally ignoring them and trying to blast the ball through five opponents with his RIGHT foot, only to mis-hit it and see the ball, for the umpteenth time, rebound off the defenders, out of the box into midfield, to be picked up by a Bury player.

Ishy curling a panic shot yards beyond the far post when there were at least 2 or 3 passes available, to players far better placed than him to score. Don't meant to pick on Ishy as he did most things very well, it's just that I remember that chance - it's giving me nightmares thinking about how easy a goal could have come from it.

And many many more, until we were all - players, manager and fans alike - totally frustrated and ready to chew our plastic seats off their frames in disgust.

I could say this all left me frustrated, but it did much more than that, it left me very very angry that what was promised, an all-out battle for the title, never materialised and at times some of the defending would have been better-placed in Pleck Park with the amateurs.

Cooper - disinterested - get rid now.
Gerrard - awful, awful, awful. For that goal alone I'd drop him NOW.
Benjamin - must drop to the bench with Sam preferred to start
Ishy - must start, otherwise we have no width and no threat

Everyone else - average, no telling contributions at all, though can't criticise Keatesey for effort.

Need alcohol to make me feel better, I am SO peed off by this incredible massive let-down ! I wanted to feel like last week again, but can't you just rely on the Saddlers to snatch it away ?

[Cheesebag]

Need alcohol to make me feel better, I am SO peed off by this incredible massive let-down ! I wanted to feel like last week again, but can't you just rely on the Saddlers to snatch it away ?

If you have to turn to drink you need professional help

Regards


Cheese

(currently supping my way through my 2nd bottle of White Grenache)

[geoffwhiting]

Need alcohol to make me feel better, I am SO peed off by this incredible massive let-down ! I wanted to feel like last week again, but can't you just rely on the Saddlers to snatch it away ?

If you have to turn to drink you need professional help

Regards


Cheese

(currently supping my way through my 2nd bottle of White Grenache)

Cheese,

Thanks. You are absolutely correct, that is very good advice.

Maybe I'll get another accountant round then, to help me drink the bloody stuff. I think I'll ring my co-Director, he's a professional ( accountant or boozer, or BOTH ! ).

Thanks so much,

Geoff :?

[Cheesebag]

Need alcohol to make me feel better, I am SO peed off by this incredible massive let-down ! I wanted to feel like last week again, but can't you just rely on the Saddlers to snatch it away ?

If you have to turn to drink you need professional help

Regards


Cheese

(currently supping my way through my 2nd bottle of White Grenache)

Cheese,

Thanks. You are absolutely correct, that is very good advice.

Maybe I'll get another accountant round then, to help me drink the bloody stuff. I think I'll ring my co-Director, he's a professional ( accountant or boozer, or BOTH ! ).

Thanks so much,

Geoff :?

Ta-Dah... :lol:

[geoffwhiting]

Need alcohol to make me feel better, I am SO peed off by this incredible massive let-down ! I wanted to feel like last week again, but can't you just rely on the Saddlers to snatch it away ?

If you have to turn to drink you need professional help

Regards


Cheese

(currently supping my way through my 2nd bottle of White Grenache)

Cheese,

Thanks. You are absolutely correct, that is very good advice.

Maybe I'll get another accountant round then, to help me drink the bloody stuff. I think I'll ring my co-Director, he's a professional ( accountant or boozer, or BOTH ! ).

Thanks so much,

Geoff :?

Ta-Dah... :lol:

Toodle-pip, bottoms up ! :D